Talk:Omar Sharif

A news item involving Omar Sharif was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the In the news section on 10 July 2015.

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This article has been viewed enough times in a single week to appear in the Top 25 Report 2 times. The weeks in which this happened:

July 5 to 11, 2015 (13th)
April 8 to 14, 2018 (10th)

Archives

Archive 1 (Mar 2006—June 2009)
Archive 2 (July 2009—Dec 2017)

YouTube video

A YouTube video is currently provided as source [11] in the article, with the title "Sharif talks about his origins in an interview in the 1990s". Is it in breach of copyright? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:39, 31 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Lebanese origins of Omar Sharif

Through the years the most commonly accepted version of the origins of his parents was that they were Lebanese Melkite Christians and emigrated to Alexandria from Zahle, Lebanon. Notable sources throughout the years that have stated this:

-From a newspaper article of 1977 (year his autobiography "The Eternal Male" came out)- https://books.google.se/books?id=JPEvAAAAMAAJ&q=Omar+Sharif+Zahle&dq=Omar+Sharif+Zahle&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwifyYfZvp3qAhUNXpoKHRH3CRkQ6AEwBHoECAMQAg

-From 2001- https://books.google.se/books?id=VrXpeELOUNsC&pg=PA188&dq=Omar+Sharif+Zahle&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwifyYfZvp3qAhUNXpoKHRH3CRkQ6AEwAnoECAAQAg#v=onepage&q=Omar%20Sharif%20Zahle&f=false

-From 2007- https://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/profiles/omar-sharif-hits-and-misses-6228824.html

-From 2011- https://www.egypt-today.com/en/103/omar-sharif-heart-attack-rumors-false

-From 2012- https://books.google.se/books?id=tzsRk0hvb_MC&pg=PA195&dq=Omar+Sharif+Lebanon&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjMiLnw2qLqAhWPepoKHf_dCtIQ6AEwAHoECAMQAg#v=onepage&q=Omar%20Sharif%20Lebanon&f=false

-In 2015, the year he died, hundreds of obituaries were published by all the notable newspaper and not one says his parents came from Damascus and Latakia. https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-26277821

Regarding what has come from Omar Sharif himself we got what he has said and been quoted on in writing, his autobiography and what he has said on tv and radio:

-In 1997 in an article regarding the newly released documentary back in 1996 "Lebanon...Imprisoned Splendour" https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0239555/ starring Omar Sharif himself, Sharif says in his own words "You never stop being Lebanese" when talking about his roots https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1997-sep-25-ca-35779-story.html

I have been unable to watch the whole documentary but Daizy Gedeon, director of the documentary, said and I quote "Out of the generosity of his heart and because of his deep love for Lebanon, Omar Sharif, one of the 20th Century’s 20th Century’s global cinematic giants, joined me on that first journey as my co-presenter. Omar provided a unique dimension to the documentary by sharing some extraordinarily, personal tales about his Lebanon". Source: https://lebanonimprisonedsplendour.com/about/. You can see a scene of the documentary where Sharif recites a poem about "his Lebanon" in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUEe-6FtXr4. I have a hard time thinking someone whose ancestors are not from Lebanon would be doing and saying this.

-Regarding his written autobiography of 1977 titled "The Eternal Male", I have not been able to obtain a copy to see where he says there his ancestors are from. However, American genealogist Henry Louis Gates used "The Eternal Male" as his bibliography for his entry of Omar Sharif on pages 355-357 of his book Dictionary of African Biography and he says he was of Lebanese Catholic origin not Syrian. https://books.google.se/books?id=39JMAgAAQBAJ&pg=RA4-PA355&lpg=RA4-PA355&dq=dictionary+of+african+biography+omar+sharif&source=bl&ots=1Ael0luxXn&sig=ACfU3U3e1E1UG1ezu1sDY2-10zpzvYYxyw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjgpean4p3qAhWpmIsKHQMvC7oQ6AEwAHoECAkQAQ#v=onepage&q=dictionary%20of%20african%20biography%20omar%20sharif&f=false

-In a 2014 article where he is quoted my times and seems to be present in an interview with the author of the of the article it also says his parents were from Zahle, Lebanon From 2014 in an article where he is quoted many times https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/omar-sharif-from-desert-prince-to-alone-in-paris-1.1787034

Now regarding what he has said on live television, a source in Arabic has been added of an interview with a Syrian TV network and Syrian interviewer Marwan Sawaf where he supposedly states his father was from Damascus and his mother was from Latakia and emigrated to Alexandria from those places and that he was of pure Syrian descent. Source- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKSi4hSWWYA

There are three problems with this source:

1)Source is not in English and cannot be easily verified by translation by most of the English speaking users here. When available, high quality sources in English are preferred and, if no English source is available, a written non-biased source in Arabic where this is stated and can be translated by Google translate and verified by English speakers here as per https://wiki.eso.workers.dev/wiki/Wikipedia:Verifiability#Non-English_sources. It is impossible for the vast majority of English speakers and English Wikipedia readers to verify an oral Arabic source and doing so is a hassle.

2) The above cannot be corroborated by any other additional written or video source out there.

3)According to the site ethinicelebs.com, only site online that tries to provide birth and marriage certificates when available as sources for their claims on ethnicity of celebrities, states that "In a 2009 appearance on Nile Cinema, an Egyptian television program, Omar stated that he was not of Syrian nor Lebanese origin, and that his parents and grandparents were all Egyptian". https://ethnicelebs.com/omar-sharif I have not been able to locate this tv interview perhaps due to it being in Arabic. If someone can provide the link it would be appreciated.

The above means that his tv interviews are non-reliable sources due to the inconsistency of what he has said on live TV. It is possible that on live television Omar Sharif changed his story depending on context. Depending on the country of the interview he might have changed his story because he wanted to earn fans there and told them what they wanted to hear because he was a people pleaser perhaps. If the interview was in Egypt he would say his parents were of Egyptian origin and if he was in Syria he would say they were of Syrian origins.Chris O' Hare (talk) 21:41, 25 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

ethinicelebs.com is not a RS. A TV interview where Sahrif himself says that his family is from Damascus: [1]. I'm not an expert in arabic but he clearly says that both his parents and grandparents are from Damascus. He also says "Dimashq" and not "Sham" (Bilad al Sham) so it is clear that he is talking about the city. The interviewer asks him about that why he is known in the Arab world as "Lebanese" "from Zahle" and says "when you are Syrian" and Omar reply's that the entire region was originally one and was divided, areas with more Christians became Lebanon, and there are many from the Chalhoub family in Zahle (Lebanon), but that his family is from Damascus. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 13:58, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Chris, in what other source does Omar Sharif say that he is Lebanese or his family is from Lebanon? According to the documentary "Lebanon...Imprisoned Splendour" it says: "because of his deep love for Lebanon, Omar Sharif, one of the 20th Century’s global cinematic giants, joined me on that first journey as my co-presenter. Omar provided a unique dimension to the documentary by sharing some extraordinarily, personal tales about his Lebanon. What together Omar and I, brought global awareness to, through Lebanon".... nothing of this say he is Lebanese. In the TV interview I linked to above he says that when he was young he had a cough and his mother used to take him to Lebanon for the clean air, so he spent time in Lebanon. He is allowed to love other countries, this doesn't contradict him being of Syrian origin. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 19:26, 28 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Chris the video was provided in the sources he literally says that his family origins are in Damascus See https://streamable.com/e9u5t4 4353Phone (talk) 19:25, 28 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

“You never stop being Lebanese,” says Omar Sharif, even though he has become the most internationally renowned Egyptian film star of all time. But Sharif was born Michel Shalhoub in Lebanon and has never forgotten his roots" says in https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1997-sep-25-ca-35779-story.html. That his parents are from Lebanon or even he himself born there is stated in interviews and articles where Sharif is in front of the author/interviewer of the article, such as that LA Times source and this one https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/omar-sharif-from-desert-prince-to-alone-in-paris-1.1787034.

I would have no problem stating "some sources say his parents were from Syria and others that his parents were from Lebanon" and teach the controversy as per https://wiki.eso.workers.dev/wiki/Wikipedia:Don%27t_%22teach_the_controversy%22. But the sources that state his is from Syria: 1) Are in Arabic and cannot be easily verified by translation by most of the English speaking users here, 2) Cannot be corroborated by any other additional independent relaible written, video or oral source IN ENGLISH out there 3) In his tv interviews Sharif seems to have changed his story to please the interviewer depending on context and perhaps to earn fans in the country where he is interviewed such as the one in Syria done by Syrian Marwan Sawaf for a Syrian TV Network (In an 2009 appearance on Nile Cinema, an Egyptian television program, Omar stated that it was not the case in parents were Syrian or Lebanese, and that his parents and grandparents were all Egyptian. In a 2010 interview with the Gulf Times he did the same https://web.archive.org/web/20110606042356/http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topics/article.asp?cu_no=2&item_no=350053&version=1&template_id=36&parent_id=16). Remember that this is a guy that changed his name and religion to marry someone so perhaps he was a compulsive people pleaser like his changing around of his life story in tv interviews seem to show.

If a reliable independent source in English state his father was from Damascus and his mother from Latakia then the controversy needs to be said in his article as per https://wiki.eso.workers.dev/wiki/Wikipedia:Don%27t_%22teach_the_controversy%22. Since no reliable independent source in English has been added for this where he states this then the most independent reliable source needs to be used which is the book by renowned genealogist Henry Louis Gates who uses his biography "The Eternal Male" as a source and states his family is of Lebanese Melkite descent https://books.google.com/books?id=39JMAgAAQBAJ&q=Sharif+Lebanese&pg=RA4-PA355.Chris O' Hare (talk) 00:36, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Chris , I don't know why, latimes reported "You never stop being Lebanese,"... we know he spent time in Lebanon, maybe thats why? He has a connection to Lebanon?

Where are you getting this from? "Nile Cinema, an Egyptian television program, Omar stated that it was not the case in parents were Syrian or Lebanese, and that his parents and grandparents were all Egyptian.", where is the source for this?

The Gulf times source you link to says "Sharif further maintained he was Egyptian, whereas misconceptions suggested that he was of Lebanese origin.".. this does not mean he doesn't have a Syrian origin, he can be Egyptian despite having a Syrian background. The same way Arnold Schwarzenegger is both american and austrian.

You said: "But the sources that state his is from Syria: 1) Are in Arabic and cannot be easily verified by translation by most of the English speaking users here," , I translated the filmed TV interview above for you and told you what he said about his parents and grandparents.

We could have something like: "Some sources have reported that Sharif is of Lebanese origin. But in a filmed TV interview Sharif has clarified that both his parents and grandparents are from Damascus, Syria"

--Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 13:33, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Legion of Honour

Can anyone find a citation for this? OGBC1992 (talk) 21:01, 28 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Syrian origins?

Omar Sherif has a video where he mentions that all his grandparents originated from Syria, specifically from Damascus, Latakia, and Hama. Is it acceptable to use this YouTube video as a source for citation?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPYI2oGXZqY Thatsyrianitalian (talk) 01:03, 3 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think not, per https://wiki.eso.workers.dev/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:VIDEOLINK&redirect=no

but I’ve gathered reliable sources that mention he was of Syrian and lebanese descent.

the Washington post: https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/omar-sharif-international-heartthrob-of-lawrence-of-arabia-and-doctor-zhivago-dies-at-83/2015/07/10/10016f80-270a-11e5-b72c-2b7d516e1e0e_story.html

NBC: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna389936

CBS: https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/omar-sharif-dead-at-83/

The Independent: https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/features/omar-sharif-dead-his-ten-best-films-from-lawrence-of-arabia-to-hidalgo-10381177.html

Thé National News: https://www.thenationalnews.com/arts/a-look-back-at-the-life-of-omar-sharif-1.46987?outputType=amp

all of the aforementioned sources are reliable per: Wikipedia:RSP Whatsupkarren (talk) 08:16, 12 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

They can work, but, in the interview he says all of his grandparents immigrated from Syria to Egypt, nothing to do with Lebanon, so I'm not sure why Lebanese should be mentioned. Thatsyrianitalian (talk) 14:26, 12 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

i know, there are other videos where he literally said he was of Syrian descent and not Lebanese. however, according to Wikipedia policies, we can't cite a video uploaded by a random channel. Whatsupkarren (talk) 14:54, 12 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the sources! Thatsyrianitalian (talk) 14:27, 12 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]