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August 31

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August 31, 2022 (2022-08-31) (Wednesday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

International relations

(Posted) RD: Elizabeth Bailey

[edit]
Article: Elizabeth Bailey (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): WSJ
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American economist. Death announced on this date. Article needs some work before it can be ready for homepage / RD. Apologies for the tail-loading of this nomination. It was a long weekend here. . Edits done. Article meets hygiene expectations for homepage / RD. RIP. Life well-lived. Ktin (talk) 03:16, 6 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Ruth Lapide

[edit]
Article: Ruth Lapide (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): FAZ + many others
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: German theologian who studied in Israel and returned to Germany to promote understanding of Jews and Christians, first with her more prominent husband, after his death with her son. Book, lectures, television. Many high awards. The article was slim and underreferenced. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:06, 3 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Mary Noel Menezes

[edit]
Article: Mary Noel Menezes (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Guyanese nun and historian - Dumelow (talk) 19:54, 1 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Support. The article looks up-to-par. — Red-tailed hawk (nest) 19:56, 1 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Luke Bell

[edit]
Article: Luke Bell (musician) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CNN
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Country musician who died after disappearing for over a week. Andise1 (talk) 23:16, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Please be reminded that the Discography should be fully sourced and there should be some well-developed prose -- 171 words would be too stubby. Please expand this wikipage and add more REFs. --PFHLai (talk) 02:04, 1 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Almost there. Can someone give this one final push? I have no clue about this topic unfortunately, but, was able to fill the discography references and it is almost complete. All that is pending is to add a source for the stated fact that Scott Fund was the director of Luke Bell's music video Where ya been? Can one of you take a look at this one? Ktin (talk) 19:09, 7 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Folks, we have 20 minutes and one CN tag and that too an orthogonal one (which can even be deleted if needed) to get this one onto the homepage. Anyone knowledgeable enough to fill the CN tag? Ktin (talk) 23:37, 7 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Steep fall in US life expectancy

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(NON-ADMIN CLOSURE)
Thanks for the nomination. Consensus to post not likely to evolve. Ktin (talk) 00:58, 1 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Proposed image
Life expectancy at birth, by sex: United States, 2000–2021
Article: United States (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Life expectancy in the United States declines sharply, falling by about three years in the last three years. (Post)
News source(s): NYT; FT; BBC; NPR
Credits:
Nominator's comments: This seems a big story but I'm not yet finding updates in any of the various pages we have which touch on this. Note that the decline is just not due to COVID but also other factors like drug overdoses. The decline is being presented as a historic turnaround. Andrew🐉(talk) 21:16, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, but I think that this probably won't get consensus. It is a major story nonetheless, although the life expectancy being what it was in 1996 provides a sense of perspective. I was too young to have any memories from that year, but I am willing to bet that most people didn't consider life expectancy to be low then. --RockstoneSend me a message! 21:33, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose and snow close oh no, the end of the world! Come on, life expectancy has dropped worldwide as a result of the pandemic. _-_Alsor (talk) 21:41, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Not really earth shattering news Masem (t) 21:50, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak oppose I can kinda see an argument for it, but it doesn't really seem like significant news, especially when it's already been falling. The Kip (talk) 21:51, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose The proposed story only covers one country. As mentioned by Alsoriano97, it's likely Covid reduced life expectancy in many/most countries around the world. Therefore there doesn't seem to be any good reason why Wikipedia should publish an ITN item about one particular country's fall in life expectancy but ignore the other 99% of countries on the planet. Chrisclear (talk) 21:52, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • To see some comparisons with other countries see BMJ. The US suffered badly with countries like Bulgaria and Russia while in some countries such as Norway and New Zealand, life expectancy went up. Andrew🐉(talk) 22:01, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Those countries are not a good comparison though. Bulgaria, Norway and New Zealand have small populations, Russia is a different kettle of fish altogether with very specific reasons for their long ongoing decline in life expectancy. Abcmaxx (talk) 22:11, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Given that data about countries other than the US is readily available, why did you propose a blurb about life expectancy in the US and exclude every other country? Chrisclear (talk) 22:51, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Maybe because this was data released from the CDC in the US and news organizations have reported on it? There is nothing wrong with proposing an ITN item relating to a single country. Pawnkingthree (talk) 23:12, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I agree in a more general sense that there is nothing wrong with proposing an ITN item relating to a single country. However in this situation, its a phenomenon that clearly relates to more than just the one country nominated. This nomination is just as nonsensical as a hypothetical nomination about the decline in life expectancy in Bulgaria only. Chrisclear (talk) 00:37, 1 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I'm not sure I follow. It's notable that a developed country like the United States has had such a steep fall in life expectancy that other developed liberal democracies have not experienced. If the UK had experienced a steep drop and the United States did not, I would propose posting this here, too. Either way, this isn't going to be posted, so someone should just close the discussion. --RockstoneSend me a message! 00:42, 1 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Posted) RD: Lee Thomas

[edit]
Article: Lee Thomas (baseball) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): MLB, AP
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 – Muboshgu (talk) 19:48, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 30

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August 30, 2022 (2022-08-30) (Tuesday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

International relations

Law and crime

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Don L. Lind

[edit]
Article: Don L. Lind (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CollectSPACE.com, KSL, Deseret
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Payload Commander of STS-51-B. This wikibio could use some refreshing. A sentence on the subject's death is not there yet. PFHLai (talk) 19:18, 4 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Support, looks like there is no more detail than that I have already added - Dumelow (talk) 19:29, 4 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Steve White

[edit]
Article: Steve White (American football) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Tampa Bay Times
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 – Muboshgu (talk) 22:20, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment: On the borderline of what I'd consider "too brief" (3 well-formed paragraphs is typically the minimum standard). Can anything else be said about his career, specifically the regular season in 1999 when he was a regular starter? With another sentence or two, weak support (with possible upgrade to full support depending on amount of info added). SpencerT•C 04:58, 2 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Spencer, never before have I heard "three well-formed paragraphs". This is short but not a stub. I'll try to add a little more, but I am also taking a weekend trip for Labor Day weekend and will have limited time the next couple days. – Muboshgu (talk) 15:19, 2 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I should have clarified that that is my minimum standard based on my reading of WP:ITN. Per that, "In the case of a new, event-specific article, the traditional cut-off for what is enough has been around three complete, referenced and well-formed paragraphs." Specifically for RDs, since the "event" is the whole person's life, I take that to be the minimum length for any article posted to ITN. Other minds may disagree with the application to RDs, but I've found it a good rule of thumb for depth for a whole article, and I cannot recall us posting an article to RD that was not at this length at minimum. On re-assessment of the article, including your recent additions, seems to meet that minimum standard, so support. SpencerT•C 21:45, 2 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted. --PFHLai (talk) 08:55, 3 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Fauziyya Hassan

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Article: Fauziyya Hassan (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Onmanorama news Raajje
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Maldivian actress, article appears to be well referenced (unusual for an article of its type!). Couple of missing refs in the credits section, not my area of interest but will see if I can fill those in. Article needs updating Dumelow (talk) 06:45, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi PFHLai, I've expanded the lead. I couldn't source the last three titles in the filmography section. These could just be commented out until sourced, if it will hold up posting - Dumelow (talk) 08:19, 6 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the expansion, Dumelow. Yes, unverified items are often removed. --PFHLai (talk) 10:24, 6 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Hi PFHLai, I've removed these uncited ones - Dumelow (talk) 10:44, 6 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted Blurb) RD/Blurb: Mikhail Gorbachev

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Overwhelming consensus to blurb; no more post-posting supports required.Pawnkingthree (talk) 01:24, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Proposed image
Article: Mikhail Gorbachev (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  Former President of the Soviet Union Mikhail Gorbachev (pictured) dies at the age of 91. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ The last President of the Soviet Union Mikhail Gorbachev dies at the age of 91.
Alternative blurb II: ​ The last President of the Soviet Union and Nobel Peace Prize Mikhail Gorbachev (pictured) dies at the age of 91.
Alternative blurb III: ​ Former General Secretary of the Communist Party and President of the Soviet Union Mikhail Gorbachev dies at the age of 91.
News source(s): CNN, Reuters (CNN gives age at death as 92)
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Last leader of the Soviet Union, from 1985 to 1991. Article has been GA since January 2020. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 20:40, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Hatting the most ridiculous !vote in the world per WP:DENY.
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
I usually don’t make these type of replies, but I have to. This was one of the world’s most influencial and important leaders in the 20st century. Please tell me you are joking. BastianMAT (talk) 20:54, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Pretty sure this was a pointy !vote - Floydian τ ¢ 20:56, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Trolling. Dennis Dartman (talk) 21:00, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
User had only a handful of edits including a few prods, and knows how to add inline formatted refs, hmmm [eye roll] Bumbubookworm (talk) 21:01, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Please read -> [1] TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 20:55, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
He's a very important figure. He was the last leader of the USSR, and helped with perestroika. Dennis Dartman (talk) 20:56, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Don't make me tap the sign...
Do not add simple "support!" or "oppose!" votes without including your reasons. Similarly, curt replies such as "who?", "meh", or "duh!" are usually not helpful. XxLuckyCxX (talk) 21:00, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Removed) Ongoing Removal: COVID-19 pandemic

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Even though I highly disagree with it, it's pretty obvious that the decision to remove this from ongoing is not going to be reverted yet again, and so this discussion serves no further purpose. Let's close it and move on. (non-admin closure) --RockstoneSend me a message! 21:10, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: COVID-19 pandemic (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item removal (Post)
Nominator's comments: Per discussion and closed debate below, I'm reopening this to allow fresh discussion unsullied by the back-and-forth over the pulling and reinstatement saga. To restate my rationale here, I have been reticent to remove covid from ongoing in the past, but LaserLegs's nomination statement below is sound, and in most parts of the world the ongoing newsworthiness and daily updates are not there. We can always put it back if the pandemic flares up again, and we are not obliged to wait for the WHO. Please allow this nom to run for at least a day or two before assessing consensus, to avoid the drama seen below.  — Amakuru (talk) 15:39, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support - We can't just wait up for China indefinitely. Monkeypox seems to have become the more dominant health story in the news (at least if Portal:Current events is anything to go by). -- 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 15:49, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    • It's difficult to say now, but monkeypox will probably not spread in such extent as Covid, it is not a new, unresearches disease. "given that MPV spreads primarily through close contact, it is less efficient at spreading between humans." [2]. Kirill C1 (talk) 16:22, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
      And that may be true, but the fact is that monkeypox has been dominating the headlines. Whether or not it's due to media hysteria induced by the impact of prior pandemics is up for debate, of course. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 16:44, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per the requirement that The Ongoing line is for regularly updated articles which cover events that remain in the news over a longer period of time. The article is not regularly updated and there are other crises now which appear much more frequently in the news than covid. Polyamorph (talk) 15:55, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - I think removal would be the right thing to do. Keeping this up is like if we kept Climate change up because it is ongoing forever. There has to be a point in time where the event is not receiving regular updates and I believe we have reached that point. Interstellarity (talk) 16:12, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support It's time. The disease has effectively become endemic and the main article is not receiving the level of updates expected for an ongoing. Any major developments in this story can be addressed on a case-by-case basis through routine nomination and discussion process. -Ad Orientem (talk) 16:14, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - there are Covid waves still, in some countries it is influential. Let's look at TheGuardian home page. [3]. What are the main sectons above? World, UK, Coronavirus. If one of the most reliable sources thinks it still important, we shouldn't remove it. Kirill C1 (talk) 16:17, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    There are eight more main sections, so I feel you just stopped there for effect. InedibleHulk (talk) 17:01, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    But Coronavirus is specifically the third most important topic listed there, more important than football (in UK website, yeah). We follow reliable source in terms of coverage when we consider news for blurb, then we need to look at whether the setion is in constant focus on RS. Kirill C1 (talk) 17:36, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I had a look at that so-called "Coronavirus" section while I was arbitrarily stopped. What percentage of its current news stories do you think are primarily filed under a more topically appropriate section's name and just happen to also mention The Big C for background? That's right, 72.727%! Chinese heat wave, French Disneyrail outage, 1982 Australian murder...think about it. InedibleHulk (talk) 17:43, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Is your number representative? How many news items did you check? On the contrary, it gives many new items, as well as one of the most important topics now - vaccinations. [4] [5] For vaccinations alone the topic shouldn't be removed from ongoing. Kirill C1 (talk) 17:58, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I sampled all eleven, sir; three were positive. Of the two you show me now, one (already checked) is primarily Global development (that ongoing North-South divide). The other one (from August 20) looks legit, a Coronavirus topic, four of twelve. InedibleHulk (talk) 18:17, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    So, the news items that are onfront page are not a proper sample - it is more deductive to see news for a longer period. Kirill C1 (talk) 19:06, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I didn't test the front page, just the COVID section. But yeah, I suppose a larger study is a better study. Not sure how I feel about pushing nasal vaccines, though, I'll sleep on that. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:33, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Restrictions have been coming down across most of the world, and Covid isn't mentioned as much as it was. Still happening isn't an excuse for an article to stay on Ongoing. It's interesting people use the surge in China as an excuse to oppose removal when even those child articles aren't receiving regular, substantial updates. Given the lack of substantial updates at the target article, which is what we look at for the requirement, this clearly doesn't qualify for ongoing any longer. It's still happening, yes, but fails the criteria for ITN Ongoing. NoahTalk 16:22, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support for all the reasons in the previous nom where there was obvious consensus to remove and a rogue admin disregarded the same. Opposes which disregard Wikipedia:In_the_news#Ongoing_section guidelines are rightly ignored for the purpose of evaluating consensus. --LaserLegs (talk) 16:28, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support It has receded from the news, it cannot stay up indefinitely, and it is not receiving a sufficient level of updates. I am not convinced by arguments that sub-articles are being updated.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 16:34, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - it's no longer resulting in daily blurb-worthy news as it once was. Levivich 16:36, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support The practical reality stands that besides China, which is attempting the likely-untenable goal of zero-COVID, the world has moved on. Cases, deaths, and restrictions are a small fraction of what once was, and restrictions have for the most part been rolled back. It’s an acceptable time for removal. If we were to keep it in purely because the WHO still defines it as a pandemic, we’d have the AIDS pandemic listed; if we kept it wholly because it’s still happening, we’d have climate change listed, and that was literally shot down yesterday. The Kip (talk) 16:38, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Wait - multiple things can be true at the same time. a) much of the world has moved on, at least surfacially b) the article itself, as a few folks have noted, is not seeing many edits c) not many of our readers are clicking that link on the homepage, btw. 60k across a month is arguably a small number d) but, COVID is still an epidemic and has not been downgraded to endemic as a few editors have noted e) scratch the surface and you will note that across the globe we really have not returned to the normal (perhaps we never will, who knows) f) there are still many evolving guidelines and actions that are happening across the globe even if not in some of the countries that we are in. With all of this, I recommend either wait until September 15/16 when the next clickstream data comes in and/or update the link to timeline of COVID events -- something like this [6] (or perhaps something better) which might be more pertinent than our current link perhaps? Good luck and be kind. Ktin (talk) 16:36, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per Polyamorph. DarkSide830 (talk) 16:41, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per usual et al. InedibleHulk (talk) 16:47, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per InedibleHulk. GoldenRing (talk) 17:10, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, this is long overdue. – Ammarpad (talk) 17:16, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose is still a pandemic, however much it may behave like an endemic virus. We should have waited for a WHO statement confirming this and put an end to the pandemic declaration. _-_Alsor (talk) 17:42, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    WHO rightfully isn't concerned about whether or not a topic is in the news or whether it receives regular updates. But that does mean that by the time WHO sees fit to declare COVID-19 endemic, the news will have long stopped covering it, and a section labeled "In The News" on Wikipedia would look particularly archaic in having waited so long to make a decision. Similar lack of coverage was present on ITN when Ebola and Zika were declared to no longer be PHEICs. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 17:56, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    When WHO sees it fit to be declared, the news will cover WHO decision, of course, with some retrospective in-depth articles. Kirill C1 (talk) 18:01, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - Shenzhen apparently just went into lockdown per Reuters, I think it's too early for this to be removed. There should be no rush for an encyclopedia to make this change when the pandemic is still ongoing, there will come a day when that is no longer the case but not yet. Covid is still in an acute phase, it has not yet become merely chronic like the HIV example. - Indefensible (talk) 18:16, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - it's still a thing that affects a lot of people, with daily infection rates above half a million. Many news articles are still being produced about it, so it's in the news. Aren't those the only two criteria? —VersaceSpace 🌃 18:40, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    See Wikipedia:In the news#Ongoing section, which details the criteria. NoahTalk 18:45, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per above. It is still a pandemic and it is still in the news. Davey2116 (talk) 18:46, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - this is long, long overdue. Covid is no longer news, it's an endemic disease world-wide, and will remain so. This is akin to keeping a link to Malaria as Ongoing in ITN, which kills millions of people every year. --Soman (talk) 18:49, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    two years of pandemic for you to say this? Not the same. _-_Alsor (talk) 19:29, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support The WHO is unlikely to declare it endemic, but COVID isn’t in the news anymore. 58-59% of Americans don’t view COVID as a threat. It just isn’t discussed anymore, and In The News doesn’t mean Broadcasting COVID-19. 47.19.209.230 (talk) 20:00, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • support removal It is sadly clear that most governments and the majority of people don't give a stuff anymore (this coming from a person who voluntarily wears masks everywhere still), and the reinstatement was just the personal preference of a higher authority driving by to put us plebs in place again. Consensus was clear then and it is in this reset Bumbubookworm (talk) 20:10, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I checked my country's national news sources and (to my genuine surprise) there isn't actually any updates about COVID on the front page anymore. YD407OTZ (talk) 20:56, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Although I know the goal was to keep this up for a while, worth noting there's a pretty clear consensus in favor of removal at the moment. The Kip (talk) 21:15, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I don't see the consensus that you claim to see. I see a lot of people overly eager to get rid of this from ongoing for no good reason. -- RockstoneSend me a message! 21:20, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The fact remains all these oppose votes not addressing the criteria will be ignored. Still happening is not a criteria. Regular, substantial updates which add new, pertinent information is a criteria and one that has not been met as of late. NoahTalk 21:26, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose removal - The pandemic is still ongoing, and it is still in the news. If the BBC and the Guardian can both find enough material to maintain entire news website sections about it, it's still very much in the news. GenevieveDEon (talk) 21:16, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose removal' -- COVID-19 is still in the news, and thousands are still dying daily. Not time to remove it yet, there's no reason to remove it just because a small segment of the Wikipedia community wants to pretend COVID-19 doesn't exist anymore. It does, and it's not endemic. Also, articles linking to COVID-19 are still being regularly updated. See here -- RockstoneSend me a message! 21:18, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    No one is pretending it doesn't exist. I actually have covid right now. It simply isn't in the news the way it was. In terms of deaths, road accidents are killing more people daily than covid. But we don't have road collisions in ongoing. Polyamorph (talk) 21:32, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    We would need to hold a discussion to determine if the criteria covers child articles as well. As written and generally interpreted currently, it does not. I might as well start a RfC on the talk page now. NoahTalk 21:34, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal - I suggested this some time ago but was over-ruled. No longer headline news. — Voice of Clam 21:45, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal the message now is we just "live with it". Certainly if we get a shitty new mutation which evades vaccinations and causes massive mortality, we can re-visit this (if anyone's left alive to deal with it), but in the meantime, it's just background deaths, like gun-crime in the US. The Rambling Man (Keep wearing the mask...) 21:59, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose removal, as per my comments yesterday in my request to reinstate it. The pandemic is still the subject of ongoing news and COVID-19 has not yet been declared endemic. Pandemics are not inherently open-ended; someday it will be over. But the expectation that the pandemic is almost over has been around almost as long as the pandemic has, and every prediction so far has been premature. I don't think the pandemic should stay on here forever, but I don't think this is the time to remove it. Tisnec (talk) 22:05, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Again, “it’s still going on” is not a criteria on WP:ITNR. The Kip (talk) 22:10, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's still receiving news coverage, though, which satisfies WP:ITNCRIT - "the event is appearing currently in news sources". It's definitely less news than before, and I think we're close to a notability tipping point, but I've seen several stories just today. The only other necessary criterion is consensus, which is what we're debating here. Tisnec (talk) 22:15, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
What does that have to do with accepting his apology? --RockstoneSend me a message! 17:13, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
No need. It was a good pull, consensus remained strong even after the pull until a rogue admin yeeted it back into the box. --LaserLegs (talk) 09:20, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yikes, LaserLegs, NO this was not a good pull. -- RockstoneSend me a message! 09:36, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I agree there is no need to apologise, but the fact that you have demonstrates how good an admin you are. Polyamorph (talk) 09:33, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Personally, I feel you have nothing to apologize for. Consensus was just as clear then as it is now. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 12:24, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
No, it's the 'glamour' commanding officers from the wild west era of 15+ years ago who often try to pull faits accompli on everyone that is the problem, especially when they don't participate on a routine basis but carpetbag in to impose their choice on the 'glamour' topics. Bumbubookworm (talk) 12:29, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal, in terms of news coverage this is nothing compared to what it was before / during the vaccine rollout. – filelakeshoe (t / c) 🐱 08:08, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal as I have done previously, per Wikipedia:ONGOING. The article linked has not received significant updates - Dumelow (talk) 08:32, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Another comment - this request for comment should probably be brought to the wider community. I notice a lot of people commenting for and against in the previous removal discussion who have not yet commented here. No matter the outcome of this, someone is sure to want to bring this to WP:DRV or something. -- RockstoneSend me a message! 09:47, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    No, this is the ITN discussion page for items in the box. We don't need to WP:CANVAS more "oppose" !votes from people who don't bother to read the guidelines we have enough already. --LaserLegs (talk) 10:37, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I'm not opposed to adding this to WP:CENT. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 12:42, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal - COVID has turned into a background story at best, and unless a new wave begins to spike up it will stay that way. Regardless, as per WP:ONGOING "In general, articles are NOT posted to ongoing merely because they are related to events that are still happening. In order to be posted to ongoing, the article needs to be regularly updated with new, pertinent information." Updates to the article have become irregular at best. Prism55 (talk) 10:51, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose removal: This is still a major issue in the world, especially in SE Asia. Its economic and political effects are still very much being felt. And are likely to again in Europe/America this winter. Plenty of coverage of new vaccines etc. 2A02:A03F:61B7:5B00:84C5:B0F7:9195:2BFD (talk) 10:59, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal per above. EditMaker Me (talk) 11:14, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – Some 3,600 words later, posts running over 2:1 in favor of removal. Consensus? – Sca (talk) 12:58, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    • There is no rush whatsoever to remove this from ongoing. It's worth it to let everyone have a chance to participate even if their participation is unlikely to change the result. Have patience. Let the world turn at least once. 24hrs, even 48, is not that long. Levivich 13:54, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
      I can certainly understand that the first pull was rushed, but we’re at a full day of discussion with a pretty overwhelming consensus. I don’t see much of a point in dragging things out longer than they need to be. The Kip (talk) 15:56, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
      We're at a full day now when you posted your reply; we weren't at a full day yet two hours ago when I posted the comment you're replying to. In those two hours, three new people participated (two supports, one oppose), who would not have had the opportunity to do so had this been closed two hours ago. That's valuable in and of itself; can't you see that? I can show you innumerable examples of bad things that happened when threads were closed too soon. Can you show me any examples of bad things that happened when threads were closed too late? What is so hard about the concept of allowing (at least) 24hrs so that everyone in the world has a chance to participate? And what is with this obsession by some with commenting about when it's time to close? Do we think that, unless someone says "this should be closed now", the closers won't know when to close? All these comments do (mine here included) is needlessly add to the text on the page, to the watchlist, to the edit history. There is no need to rush. Levivich 16:56, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose the pandemic is still ongoing and there are still developments. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 12:59, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal - having just now read WP:ITNCRIT, I'm not seeing how the level of continual background activity rises to that point. For all effective purposes, this has moved into recurrent rotation now. Hog Farm Talk 13:23, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal: What a coincidence, someone on the TV News was discussing yesterday exactly this, that COVID is mostly over by now and there are hardly any more news to it. And, as pointed, the article should be having frequent news-related updates, and this one is not. The opposes that say "it's still going on at Foo" should check the criteria in WP:ONGOING. Cambalachero (talk) 13:43, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    With 712,000 new cases yesterday, "mostly over" sounds optimistic. However, since they're mainly the Omnicron variant that's less debilitating, it does seem the global crisis is ebbing at present. -- Sca (talk) 14:06, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support unless there's some noteworthy global development that makes sense to add again.--Ortizesp (talk) 13:58, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose removal. The pandemic is still ongoing, it is killing thousands per week, and several countries (most notably China) still have lockdowns in place. Much of the world population is still unvaccinated. Updates are occurring in the sub-articles and it's still receiving mainstream media coverage, even in places where legal restrictions have been lifted (e.g. there were two articles about Covid on the the front page of the Guardian website this morning). The Covid pandemic isn't over, no matter how much people (or some governments) like to pretend it is. Modest Genius talk 14:12, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I'm more worried about CC than the pandemic. 104/40 due where I live today. -- Sca (talk) 14:45, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Cool, so where does WP:ONGOING mention "sub-articles" and can you highlight a recent update for "new, pertinent information"? --LaserLegs (talk) 14:35, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Removal I would challenge anyone to cite a COVID-related event/occurrence/fact that has happened in the last six months that is of interest to anyone. We know that people continue to get it, we know that people continue to die. Simply updating the metrics is not a reason to retain this forever. GreatCaesarsGhost 15:43, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. While certainly things related to COVID will continue to be newsworthy, those can be handled as individual ITN items rather than a permanent placement. Seraphimblade Talk to me 15:47, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment it's 24 hours in. By a straight !vote count it's 32 support and 15 opposed (very high participation for ITN). The Oppose (or keep) camp points out mainly that the pandemic is still happening. The Support (or remove) camp agrees but points out that the story is stale, getting only statistic updates for a long time now. WP:ONGOING applies. Time to call it --LaserLegs (talk) 16:44, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    • What is the rush? You seem to be afraid that others will come by and oppose removal. --RockstoneSend me a message! 17:13, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
      24 hours is the frequently proposed but never officially adopted "minimum wait" and there is a clear consensus. Time to act --LaserLegs (talk) 17:37, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
      • I don't see overwhelming consensus worthy of pulling this now. What is the harm of waiting a few more days? --RockstoneSend me a message! 17:40, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
        • You are in opposition to removal. You have posted on this thread 11 times. You are not a neutral arbiter here. The consensus is what it is, and there has been plenty of time allotted for opinion in this nom and the prior. GreatCaesarsGhost 18:37, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
          • First of all, I hardly call 66% support to be "consensus" on something like this. But even if it is, you haven't answered my question. The consensus is not overwhelming, so WP:SNOW doesn't apply, and there's no harm in waiting this out a few more days. Patience, please. Why does it matter if this stays on for a while longer? -- RockstoneSend me a message! 19:32, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
            • If 2/3 of all participants does not reflect "consensus" then nothing would ever get done here. There is no question of harm, there is a question of reasonable and ordinary practice. A nomination that is open for 24 hours, has 66% support and extremely high participation is absolutely a mandate for closure and acceptance. Keeping the nomination open, with the hope that canvassing may drop the majority a bit actually would be harmful. I'm readding the "Needs attention" header for admin consideration. Please allow an ADMIN to make the decision on whether to act. GreatCaesarsGhost 19:51, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    • If there are not many updates now, the editors can update the articles. There are new lockdowns and discussions on impact of possible measures. Kirill C1 (talk) 18:01, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
      This article has been discussed for removal from Ongoing several times over the past months and the updates you are suggesting have not since happened. For all those who continue to insist it should not be removed, why have very few of said editors updated the article to meet the Ongoing standards? That someone may eventually make an update is simply not good enough. DarkSide830 (talk) 19:02, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Another comment For what it is worth, the headline story on the New York Times is the updated vaccine being approved, while the second story involves the US's steep decline in life expectancy (lowest since 1996) due mostly to COVID-19. Not that this changes the ITN criteria, but to say it is not "in the news" still is simply not true. --RockstoneSend me a message! 17:33, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak support for removal, or updating to a current timeline article per Ktin's suggestion above. COVID-19 is still a big part of what's happening in the news, but a developing-story enthusiast (or whoever actually clicks ITN links) is not going to find what they're looking for in the linked article. -- Visviva (talk) 18:07, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Procedural comment: Regarding the suggestion that we should ignore contributors who "disregard Wikipedia:In_the_news#Ongoing_section guidelines" for purposes of evaluating consensus, I would just like to point out that (a) ITN does not appear to be a guideline, (b) even if it was, guidelines derive their authority, if any, from consensus and therefore agreement with them cannot be used as a precondition to determining consensus, and (c) in general, excluding voices from the discussion is harmful to the project and the community and should be done only when strictly necessary (e.g. when there is evidence of actual manipulation, or some other reason to believe that a particular sample of Wikipedians is unrepresentative). The power of consensus comes precisely from the pressure it creates to find better and more nuanced solutions (or, as some poli sci folks would say, "increase the dimensionality of the policy space"); relieving that pressure by excluding inconvenient voices does no one any favors. I am but a humble rando, and this is but a minor issue in this case, but those are my thoughts on the matter. -- Visviva (talk) 18:07, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
"In general, articles are NOT posted to ongoing merely because they are related to events that are still happening. In order to be posted to ongoing, the article needs to be regularly updated with new, pertinent information." is a direct quote. Not sure what else to tell you. --LaserLegs (talk) 18:28, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Either we have guidelines and we enforce them, or we don't. The latter is anarchy. The former is constricting, but we can change consensus through open-ended discussions such as through WT:ITN. We don't do it through individual case studies. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 18:37, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
This isn't a court system. One case doesn't set precedent over long-established guidelines and practices. It takes broad consensus to change practices and guidelines. Consensus of that nature can't be achieved in a discussion about an item on ITN. NoahTalk 19:06, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
This site is not exactly a democracy as some like to believe it is. This is why there are no precise requirements for consensus. Personally, I do not believe ~66% of votes for something is consensus at all, but the failures of the article to be updated to Ongoing standards is not a matter of opinion. If an article is not being updated enough than the debate over the event being ongoing doesn't just mean very little, quite frankly it means nothing at all. I do not believe anyone who has opposed posting has offered an opinion as to why the article is actually meeting these standards, nor have the proper actions been taken to elevate the article to said standards. DarkSide830 (talk) 19:07, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 29

[edit]
August 29, 2022 (2022-08-29) (Monday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

Law and crime

(Posted) RD: Hans-Christian Ströbele

[edit]
Article: Hans-Christian Ströbele (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Tagesschau (DE)
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Influential German politician. SoWhy 09:22, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Charlbi Dean

[edit]
Article: Charlbi Dean (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: South African actress. I am working on referencing the article Dumelow (talk) 07:16, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Think the referencing is now up to scratch - Dumelow (talk) 07:28, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Abhijit Sen

[edit]
Article: Abhijit Sen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Indian Express
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Indian economist. Article needs some work before it can be ready. I will work on it, but, if someone wants to assist, jump right in. Basic edits done. Will continue to expand, but, This is good to go to homepage / RD. Ktin (talk) 16:17, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Ernie Zampese

[edit]
Article: Ernie Zampese (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ESPN
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American football coach. BeanieFan11 (talk) 19:02, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Ongoing Removal: COVID-19

[edit]
This discussion had veered completely off-topic, from the legitimacy of the nomination to a back and forth over admin actions. Plus several editors have cast multiple "votes" for different actions at different points in the debate, making assessment of consensus hard. I will reopen a fresh nom shortly, which will hopefully be allowed to run for a decent period of time and stay on topic.  — Amakuru (talk) 15:33, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: COVID-19 (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item removal (Post)
Nominator's comments: COVID-19 has been going on for years now and it will do so probably for all of our lifetimes (much like MERS and HIV/AIDS). It cannot be in ongoing indefinitely. Would it be suitable, for example, to put car crashes into ongoing? It's also become a very broad topic (from lockdowns, supply chain issues, human migration, political consequences, etc) spot news events (like China lockdown) related to COVID-19 do not illustrate the general topic. LaserLegs (talk) 13:19, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose; in countries still tracking Covid-19 in a reasonable way, the statistics are still high. The US reported approximately 500 daily deaths over the last week. It's also still in the news, much more so than car accidents or flu or cancer or any of our other shared ills. Vanamonde (Talk) 13:26, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    And it will likely be in the news for the next 10 years as the world calculates the social, economic and health cost of Covid and assess global/regional responses. 193.119.98.23 (talk) 14:13, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I would challenge anyone to cite a COVID-related event/occurrence/fact that has happened in the last six months that is of interest to anyone. We know that people continue to get it, we know that people continue to die. Simply updating the metrics is not a reason to retain this forever. GreatCaesarsGhost 13:54, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment It seems like debates on these are becoming more frequent while we still don't know how long an item can be considered ongoing, so I opened up a discussion on the talk page to clarify some things if possible.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 14:02, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose it is still causing widespread effects in China which still having downstream effects on world markets. Masem (t) 14:06, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I was on the fence last time because the world was seeing a bit of a wave from the latest subvariant but seeing how almost no major jurisdiction made any changes to their public health policy, except continue to remove covid-era restrictions, covid as it stands now is firmly in the past. Apart from news outlets reporting readily available stats, like a stock ticker, there hasn't been any notable developments in months. 193.119.98.23 (talk) 14:19, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support – In the past month, there has only been one substantial update to the article, and this update was not related to current events (such as direct impact). If the article is no longer actively seeing news-related updates, we should indeed remove it from our ITN box. This is not related to how much impact the pandemic is still having. The issue is that we are not covering the impact in the linked article. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 14:23, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I will note, for example, that quite a few "as of ..." sentences are dated to 2020 or 2021. We might need to be concerned about the article being outdated. I have no idea if this is an actual issue for the article, but it doesn't feel suitable for ITN. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 14:28, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. We cannot have it on ITN forever and, as mentioned above, there are no day-to-day updates to the articles as typically required for ongoing items. Yes, it made sense to have it on for way longer than any other ongoing item, but at some point we should drop it. Our readers know to use the search box if they need info. --Tone 14:35, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – S-o-o-o long-term is this topic that I'm not sure Ongoing matters much. OTOH, it does provide a hot button for a topic that affects everyone. On the fence. – Sca (talk) 15:06, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Restrictions are continuing to fall, infections have been falling, not much in terms of substantial updates at the article. NoahTalk 15:09, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - We can't just wait up for China indefinitely. Monkeypox seems to have become the more dominant health story in the news (at least if Portal:Current events is anything to go by).--🌈WaltCip-(talk) 15:57, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I don't see a single covid item at Portal:Current events/August 2022 that would have gotten a blurb had this not been in ongoing, and only one (on August 15) that wouldn't have gotten snow-opposed. We have to go all the way back to July 6 for an item that we even might have blurbed. Support. —Cryptic 16:10, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support – same reasons as why don't we put climate change to ongoing. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 16:12, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment. Clickstream data for the month of August is not available as of yet, and will be available on September 15 / 16. I would recommend having a look at that data before acting one way or the other here. Good luck. Ktin (talk) 16:20, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Much like the Invasion of Ukraine, it's not in the news as much but that doesn't mean it's done or over with. MyriadSims (talk) 16:21, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support not really "in the news" much anymore is it? It is endemic now in many places. No longer the crisis it was, now others have taken over. Polyamorph (talk) 16:25, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, I think at this point in time we can remove it from ongoing. Sir Joseph (talk) 16:37, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support It's time. If there is a really major development, we can deal with that on a case by case basis. -Ad Orientem (talk) 16:48, 29 August 2022 (UTC) signed belatedly[reply]
  • Support, endemic disease by now. --Soman (talk) 16:46, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Removed Consensus for removal; lack of regular updates to article as required for Ongoing items. SpencerT•C 16:48, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    updates for a topic as big as COVID will be in the sub articles. this will be a similar issue for the Ukraine war. Masem (t) 16:52, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I considered this. The issue is that we're not featuring these sub-articles on the front page. Such an indirect way of "featuring" the work of people editing articles like (for example) Chinese government response to COVID-19 (which of course isn't even linked in the main article) is not really reasonable in my opinion. It doesn't serve our readers or our community. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 07:44, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I’m here to remind you that COVID-19 will be endemic when the WHO declares it so, not when you say so. It’s still a pandemic. _-_Alsor (talk) 17:05, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    If we were to go wholly by the WHO’s definition of events, we would still have the AIDS pandemic listed. Sometimes it’s best to go by the practical reality. The Kip (talk) 02:33, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose and reinstate - The pandemic is still ongoing, and it continues to make the news. Pulling it from Ongoing with less than four hours' discussion is much too quick in any case. GenevieveDEon (talk) 18:37, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support It should not stay up indefinitely, and it is no longer receiving the regular updates required for Ongoing.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 18:39, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I personally think it is time to remove as other events have taken far more media coverage and it should not stay perpetually. -- FictiousLibrarian (talk) 18:39, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Endorse removal - It is clear that restrictions are easing almost everywhere in the world. COVID will likely be with us for a while now, but not to the point that it is affecting everyday life. Interstellarity (talk) 19:11, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Post-Removal Support Pandemic will continue, but continuous updates have not. DarkSide830 (talk) 21:15, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Request to reinstate The pandemic has not ceased to drive news, nor is it an inherently open-ended event (a charge reasonably used elsewhere here to say climate change shouldn't be listed). I believe the decision to remove it from "ongoing" was premature, and that it should be reinstated. Tisnec (talk) 00:55, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    CBC News doesn't fully reflect the global journalistic scene, of course, but insofar as it does, the pandemic really has ceased to drive. The top health story (currently top overall) is about how much weekly drinking scientists say is too much this week. The only COVID-related homepage headline is about normality's inevitable comeback. InedibleHulk (talk) 07:58, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    On the other hand, the New York Times has a little covid dashboard not unakin to Wikipedia's "In the news" infobox. (I checked two other sites: The BBC has no covid-related stories on the front page just now; CNN has two). We're probably close to covid not being news anymore - provided it doesn't have any more tricks up its sleeves - but I don't think we're there yet. Tisnec (talk) 15:15, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Request to reinstate This isn't just premature. While COVID pandemic will go on as a part of our lives, there's an ongoing big wave of COVID in Japan, South Korea, Hong Kong, Singapore, Taiwan and Vietnam (all of which are in around East/Southeast Asia), and while the monkeypox is now a bigger news than COVID, it is not growing that much in Asia as of now. I feel COVID-19 should be considered as ongoing until these waves are put under control and growth of monkeypox in Asia becomes definite. MarioJump83 (talk) 01:34, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose, reinstate until better consensus is achieved The discussion ended before I could vote on the original proposal. For something like this that has been repeatedly re-litigated on this page over the past several months, I feel like we could stand to get more opinions before making such a contentious change. On substantive grounds, the pandemic is still active, I'm still seeing stuff in the news, and I feel adverse to calling this endemic before the WHO does. Certainly, World War II managed to stay in the news for a good 6 years; what's 2.5 years to COVID? -BRAINULATOR9 (TALK) 02:09, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Reinstate. Four hours isn't enough time to develop a consensus; item should be reinstated until the discussion has had sufficient time to run its course. For the moment, I oppose removal, per Vanamonde93 and the fact that while the target article is not seeing regular significant updates, the child articles of the target article are, and I believe that is sufficient for the criteria for ongoing to be met. BilledMammal (talk) 02:29, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Post-removal support The practical reality stands that besides China, which is attempting the likely-untenable goal of zero-COVID, the world has moved on. Cases, deaths, and restrictions are a small fraction of what once was, and restrictions have for the most part been rolled back. It’s an acceptable time for removal. The Kip (talk) 02:40, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment/lean reinstate Only 20.9% of people in low-income countries have received at least one dose of a Covid vaccine.[8] (See ref for more stats) In many parts of the world, we're not out of the woods. -TenorTwelve (talk) 04:00, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support After two years of reminding people about it, yes, the pandemic and its articles still exist and everyone knows where to find them. That was the point, awareness. We thoroughly and completely helped raise it. We did not put an end to death, disease and socioeconomic turmoil. We were never supposed to. InedibleHulk (talk) 06:52, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support removal, as I did last time. The article has received precisely zero meaningful content updates in the last month - Dumelow (talk) 07:03, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Who knows when the pandemic ends, it has been in "current events" for so long. NytharT.C 07:14, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Post-removal support (since apparently some are calling for reinstatement). It's long overdue, the article is no longer receiving substantial update to warrant keeping it in Ongoing. – Ammarpad (talk) 07:20, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Reinstate. As stated above, four hours is simply not enough time to build a reasonable consensus. —Brigade Piron (talk) 08:08, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    And as restated immediately above, this new resolution and realization is long overdue, following months of trial proposals, similar discussion and (nonbinding) alternative results. InedibleHulk (talk) 09:07, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Reinstate we can remove this when Covid-19 becomes endemic, which it hasn't, yet. In the meantime, one would be hard-pressed to find any news outlets without daily Covid-related news. Banedon (talk) 08:40, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    You'd also really have to look for one that doesn't treat it as another bottomless mundane category of news, beside Politics/Government, Weather/Climate and Indigenous/Sports. InedibleHulk (talk) 08:50, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Many countries are already treating it as endemic in any case. Polyamorph (talk) 09:16, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    They're treating the literal virality as endemic. I'd like to think we're focusing on how they're treating the transmission of COVID news. This isn't In The Public Health Sector/C, after all. InedibleHulk (talk) 09:56, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Quite. Although I was responding to the OP who I think was referring to the virus. Polyamorph (talk) 10:05, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    We must remain vigilant, referring to misindentation. InedibleHulk (talk) 11:36, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Soz. Yes, Stay alert! Polyamorph (talk) 13:11, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Reinstate. This was a woefully brief discussion which should not have been closed so quickly. The pandemic is still ongoing, it is killing thousands per week, and several countries (most notably China) still have lockdowns in place. Much of the world population is still unvaccinated. Updates are occurring in the sub-articles and it's still receiving mainstream media coverage even in places where legal restrictions have been lifted. The Covid pandemic isn't over, no matter how much people like to pretend it is. Modest Genius talk 11:25, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - Those calling on ITN to wait until the virus is declared endemic are forgetting that this section is called "in the news". The criteria for remaining an ongoing item is the determination that there are still regular updates to the target article, and the item has to be pervasively in the news. Those are the only criteria, nothing to do with what the WHO says the virus is or isn't. At this time, these criteria are not being met. The discussion should be closed without reinstatement. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 11:27, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • REINSTATED - The removal was done very soon after the request was posted, which is very unusual for ITN, given it was not close to SNOW support. Many voices have asked for it to be reinstated, so it should revert back to its default state while further discussion happens. - Fuzheado | Talk 12:37, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Fuzheado strikes again! 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 12:47, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Or rather, a decision made in poor faith less than 4 hours after a proposal was posted has been reset so that a clearer and more fair consensus can be determined. - Fuzheado | Talk 13:06, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Can you point to the guidelines which stipulate a minimum wait for taking action or what compelling "keep" justification (other than 'too fast') necessitated a re-post? --LaserLegs (talk) 13:08, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    This has a wiki lawyering vibe. Anyone who has been active on ITN knows that if you take action on an item within four hours that is not clearly WP:SNOW worthy, then procedurally its legitimacy is going to be highly controversial. The requests to reinstate have been raised by experienced users and reflect this. I don't have a preference on the matter either way. - Fuzheado | Talk 13:21, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    It's a fairly straightforward question. What guidelines stipulate a minimum wait, and what compelling "keep" justification (other than 'too fast') necessitated a re-post? --LaserLegs (talk) 13:36, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    It's another unwritten rule, just like the notorious WP:MINIMUMDEATHS. NoahTalk 13:47, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I think WP:CONLEVEL does; just four hours of discussion results in the decision being made among a limited group of editors. BilledMammal (talk) 13:58, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    That certainly seems relevant in this case. - Fuzheado | Talk 14:11, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    You are asking for policy proof for something that was never asserted. I never said anything was "stipulated" or "policy," only that it was unusual how quickly it was acted on and that many voices objected to this procedural issue. It is the custom of this community that decisions for the ITN box are given enough time so that the consensus is properly determined. The COVID item was removed after a sampling period of less than four hours, resulting in users who noted the short consultation period:
    • "Pulling it from Ongoing with less than four hours' discussion is much too quick in any case,"
    • "The discussion ended before I could vote on the original proposal"
    • "Four hours isn't enough time to develop a consensus"
    • "four hours is simply not enough time to build a reasonable consensus"
    • "woefully brief discussion"
    The legitimacy of this forum is lessened when procedures and customs are not followed in the best of faith. A reversion to the prior state/status quo while discussion continues is the most fair and equitable thing to do. - Fuzheado | Talk 14:07, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    While it's true that four hours might not be an ideal length of time to judge consensus, at the time you reinstated the item, over 20 hours of discussion had elapsed, and at that point consensus was clearly heavily in favor of removing the item from ongoing. This is where I believe you made your error in judgment. You were weighing consensus based on temporal conditions that existed at the time of removal, and in doing so, imposed a supervote at a time when consensus had become more fleshed out and definitively in favor of removal. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 14:22, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I agree entirely with WaltCip here. A good admin would recognise they've made a mistake assessing the consensus and revert it. Polyamorph (talk) 14:26, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I'm quite comfortable in restoring the status quo in the name of fairness so that consensus can be properly evaluated. What concerns me is the number of folks who would dispense with good faith community norms in order to fast-track a decision they prefer. - Fuzheado | Talk 14:37, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Since when is calling another admin action a "decision made in poor faith" (your words) consistent with "good faith community norms". Do you consider your own admin actions to be unaccountable? Polyamorph (talk) 14:43, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I don't believe I have said anything of the sort. - Fuzheado | Talk 15:02, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    You certainly did. The full quote: Or rather, a decision made in poor faith less than 4 hours after a proposal was posted has been reset so that a clearer and more fair consensus can be determined. The comment is at the top of this thread. Polyamorph (talk) 15:04, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Of course I said the things in bold type. I meant in response to, "Do you consider your own admin actions to be unaccountable?" I never said my actions are "unaccountable" and I don't understand why you would attribute that sentiment to me. - Fuzheado | Talk 15:18, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    If you look at the reactions between the removal and the reinstatement, they are 50/50 in their split on their opinions on the matter. The fact is, it is so FUBAR at this point a close and re-request is likely the only way to properly come to a community decision. - Fuzheado | Talk 14:31, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I'm sorry, but this is not the first time that you've made a decision on ITN that in my view appears to go against a clear consensus. It's difficult not to have a knee-jerk reaction. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 13:09, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    @Fuzheado: Whoa, hold on. "poor faith"?! You can't possibly mean that. At the risk of sounding self-important, could everyone just chill a little bit? No one is acting in poor faith, no one is "misusing" the admin bit, we're just (as usual) kind of stumbling towards a solution because the wikipedia way is inherently messy. --Floquenbeam (talk) 13:17, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Who are you quoting with "misusing?" Apologies if it was me, but I don't recall saying that. - Fuzheado | Talk 13:22, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Someone down below said "abuse of admin privelege" regarding your action. I'm saying Spencer didn't do anything in bad faith, you didn't misuse your bit. But frankly, I was kind of hoping your very first response would be to say "oh my god, I didn't mean 'poor faith', I meant 'good faith (but incorrect)'". Floquenbeam (talk) 13:27, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I stand by my comment. I could add "unintentional" abuse, but nevertheless it was a mistake. Polyamorph (talk) 13:36, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    To be clear, I am not charging gross misuse or abuse of power, merely that Fuzheado misread and acted against consensus - in good faith. But I still believe this needs to be corrected and the ongoing item should be removed. Even if the discussion is closed with no consensus, it's nearly inevitable that it will be renominated for removal in a month barring some extraordinary development in the virus's progression. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 13:32, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose reinstatement, pull - Just for the record, although I did note that I supported removing this from ongoing earlier. I think Fuzheado acted against consensus, even if the previous removal was technically a bit early.--🌈WaltCip-(talk) 12:48, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    As noted by @BilledMammal above, consensus evaluated "technically a bit early" means it's not a proper consensus, as per WP:CONLEVEL. - Fuzheado | Talk 14:21, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Pull It is sadly clear that most governments and the majority of people don't give a stuff anymore (this coming from a person who voluntarily wears masks everywhere still), and the reinstatement was basically just another the personal preference of a higher authority driving by to put us plebs in place again Bumbubookworm (talk) 12:55, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose reinstatement, pull. Per WaltCip. Yes, the original pull was a little hasty, but we're a day in now and consensus for pulling seems fairly clear in the discussion above so I'm unsure why it was reinstated. I have been reticent to remove covid from ongoing in the past, but the nominator rationale above is sound, and in most parts of the world the ongoing newsworthiness and daily updates are not there. We can always put it back if the pandemic flares up again, and we are not obliged to wait for the WHO. @Fuzheado: please reconsider, because it will be difficult for any other admin to reverse your decision now. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 12:58, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I don't think reinstatement makes it harder to reverse. It makes it hard to reverse right away, but if the discussion is open a while longer and there's clear consensus for removal, then by definition it isn't wheel warring to reinstate a contested admin action that has broad consensus. It's been on the main page for years, we can afford to let the discussion run a little longer. --Floquenbeam (talk) 13:12, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Pull reinstating was an abuse of admin priviledge, there was clear consensus against doing so. Polyamorph (talk) 13:11, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    No, reverting a hasty bold move that did not have consensus is not abuse. - Fuzheado | Talk 13:37, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Reverting another admin action, against clear consensus, that had further developed, is very poor judgement for an admin. So I disagree. It may be well intentioned, but it is still wrong and you should revert it. Polyamorph (talk) 13:41, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I'm afraid your definition of "clear consensus," is not universally or widely held. And with this much uncertainty and doubt around the removal, a reversion to the status quo is the least controversial and most equitable move one could make while more discussion happens. - Fuzheado | Talk 13:47, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Why are you afraid? The least controversial move would have been to leave it alone. Are you completely unaware of how much opposition your action has generated? Polyamorph (talk) 13:51, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    You're definitely aware this discussion is recurrent, since last October, not four hours. You even participated. There's nothing hasty about this time, it's just the first time the result wasn't Close. InedibleHulk (talk) 14:04, 30 August 2022 (UTC
  • Oppose reinstatement, pull Restrictions have been coming down across most of the world, and Covid isn't mentioned as much as it was. Still happening isn't an excuse for an article to stay on Ongoing. It's interesting people use the surge in China as an excuse to oppose removal when even those child articles aren't receiving regular, substantial updates. Given the lack of substantial updates at the target article, which is what we look at for the requirement, this clearly doesn't qualify for ongoing any longer. It's still happening but fails the criteria for ITN Ongoing. NoahTalk 13:28, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - (1) Four hours isn't sufficient time to get a true reading of ongoing coverage around the world. (2) The lack of "reinstate" votes following the removal should not be taken as agreement with the removal, as I'm sure most people have found that it is almost always pointless to discuss decisions that have already been made. (3) The accusations of impropriety have also derailed this discussion to the point that it isn't about keeping/removing at this point, so pointing to a "consensus" in a derailed and disjointed discussion means next to nothing. GaryColemanFan (talk) 15:01, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I agree; I think at this point the best option is to procedurally close this discussion and open an RfC. BilledMammal (talk) 15:03, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Yes, let's just go ahead and close it as no consensus. What a mess. And it was one that didn't need to happen. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 15:13, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - I opened a discussion on WT:ITN regarding minimum length of time for discussions. I didn't call it an RfC because I don't think my wording is neutral enough to declare it one, but if someone wants to suggest how I can polish it up, I don't mind declaring it an RfC.--🌈WaltCip-(talk) 15:30, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Closed) Ongoing: Climate Change

[edit]
Consensus to post is unlikely to develop. However, we can post significant news pertaining to reports, protocols, initiatives and measures on climate change at any time as we did in the past. For more insights on the same topic, please see this recent discussion on the talk page.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 12:29, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: Climate change (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item nomination (Post)
News source(s): Floods in Pakistan, Heatwave in China
Credits:
Nominator's comments: Climate change is affecting people all over the globe now, it's an ongoing issue with even greater consequences than COVID-19 and the invasion of Ukraine. Cashewnøtt (talk) 09:36, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per nom. The Western US drought is a major threat to global food security as well. --LaserLegs (talk) 09:49, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. Climate change has been affecting people for years now and it will do so probably for all of our lifetimes. There is no point in adding something to ITN as ongoing if we already know it will never be removed because that's not what ITN is for. Regards SoWhy 09:56, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose This is like the third time an ongoing for CC has been suggested, but it fails as it would be ongoing indefinitely. --Masem (t) 10:15, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - I know this year new things have happened as climate change becomes more severe, but climate change has been ongoing for years and will probably continue into the future. Would it be suitable, for example, to put car crashes on ITN/Ongoing? EditMaker Me (talk) 11:44, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose – Per Masem. Too broad a topic. Spot news events related to CC would not illustrate the general topic. – Sca (talk) 12:19, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Cancelled) Artemis 1

[edit]
Launch scrubbed. Next opportunity: 2 September. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 12:37, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Proposed image
Article: Artemis 1 (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ The uncrewed Artemis 1 (rocket shown) is launched as part of the Artemis lunar human exploration program. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Artemis 1 (rocket shown) is launched for its human exploration program.
News source(s): NASA's mega-moon rocket ready for liftoff on eve of debut Artemis mission – Reuters
Credits:
Nominator's comments: Obviously significant event. Launch is expected to be in a few hours. CactiStaccingCrane (talk) 11:11, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support because, if successful, it will be the start of further moon exploration and more moon landings. Also, Artemis has a huge impact on other future space missions, such as missions containing extensive exploration of other planets, as finally completing lunar exploration and establishing bases can be a huge help in setting the first foot on Mars. But in general, it is a major event in the history of human exploration of space, since the last moon landing dates back to the early 1970s. --CDE34RFV (talk) 11:50, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 28

[edit]
August 28, 2022 (2022-08-28) (Sunday)

Arts and culture

Disasters and accidents

International relations

Law and crime

(Closed) Liverpool 9-0 Bournemouth

[edit]
Consensus not to post, also AfDing the article that consists just of basic statistics. --Tone 15:28, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: Liverpool F.C. 9–0 AFC Bournemouth (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Liverpool F.C. defeats AFC Bournemouth 9–0 at Anfield, matching the joint-largest winning margin in Premier League history. (Post)
News source(s): BBC Sport
Credits:
 EditMaker Me (talk) 12:13, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Far better as a DYK, of expanded.
Masem (t) 14:45, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 27

[edit]
August 27, 2022 (2022-08-27) (Saturday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

International relations

Law and crime

Politics and elections

Sports

(Posted) RD: Robert LuPone

[edit]
Article: Robert LuPone (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The New York Times; Associated Press
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Bloom6132 (talk) 11:24, 2 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) 2022 Pakistan floods

[edit]
Article: 2022 Pakistan floods (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Pakistan declares a state of emergency due to severe flooding, killing at least 1,003 people and affecting more than 670,000 homes. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Monsoon floods kill over 1,000 people and 700,000 livestock in Pakistan.
Alternative blurb II: ​ Floods in Pakistan kill over 1,000 people and over 700,000 livestock.
News source(s): DAWN, Al Jazeera, Tribune, BBC, The Guardian, DAWN, AP
Credits:

 Ainty Painty (talk) 01:05, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • The extreme weather events have already been in evidence all over the world this year. The Scientific American article has a reasonably global perspective, "...But scientists at the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) in Geneva say there's no doubt that higher Atlantic Ocean temperatures contributed to the disaster begun late last month. Atmospheric anomalies that led to the floods are also directly related to the same weather phenomena that a caused the record heat wave in Russia and flooding and mudslides in western China...". But our article doesn't say anything about the Atlantic, Russia or China. It doesn't even mention India, which naturally has monsoon flooding too. It's presented purely as provincial incidents rather than as a global weather pattern. Proseline rather than a coherent global narrative. Andrew🐉(talk) 08:07, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment I'd support since this is clearly ITN; however, the blurb statement about a national state of emergency does currently not seem to be in the article? I'd think we need at least clarification on that. Currently it's clear to me that this should be ITN right now, but from external sources, not really from the article. --LordPeterII (talk) 16:13, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 26

[edit]
August 26, 2022 (2022-08-26) (Friday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

International relations

Law and crime

RD: Roland Mesnier

[edit]
Article: Roland Mesnier (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The New York Times
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: White House Executive Pastry Chef from 1979 to 2004. Thriley (talk) 13:27, 31 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Aldo Mirate

[edit]
Article: Aldo Mirate (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): La Stampa
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: 79, Italian politician, deputy (1972–1979). Abcmaxx (talk) 10:43, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Espen Skjønberg

[edit]
Article: Espen Skjønberg (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NRK
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: 98, Norwegian actor (One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich, A Handful of Time, The Last Lieutenant). Orange tagged but there are plenty of sources and needs to be inputted into the career section. Filmography needs references. Otherwise the article is good. Abcmaxx (talk) 10:43, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Jalaluddin Umri

[edit]
Article: Jalaluddin Umri (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Vartgabharati
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: 87, Indian Islamic scholar, amir of Jamaat-e-Islami Hind (2007–2019). Referenced and good enough to post, although unusual subsection headings. Abcmaxx (talk) 10:43, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose Insufficient depth of coverage, does not meet 3 paragraph minimum. No clear description of what he accomplished in his role with Jamaat-e-Islami Hind. Some of the works listed lack citations. SpencerT•C 04:52, 2 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Slavko Večerin

[edit]
Article: Slavko Večerin (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Direktno
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: 65, Serbian Roman Catholic prelate, bishop of Subotica (since 2020). I believe article although not overly long is good enough to post. Abcmaxx (talk) 10:43, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Hana Zagorová

[edit]
Article: Hana Zagorová (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Radio Czechia
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: 75, Czech singer-songwriter and actress (The Hit, Hrubeš a Mareš jsou kamarádi do deště). Article is great at first glance but desperately needs a lot more references; orange tagged as a result. Filmography is incomplete as well. Abcmaxx (talk) 10:43, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 25

[edit]
August 25, 2022 (2022-08-25) (Thursday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

  • Flooding in Afghanistan this month has killed 182 people and wounded 250 more as torrential rains wrought widespread devastation in central and eastern provinces. (Al Jazeera)

Health and environment

Law and crime

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Dale Joseph Melczek

[edit]
Article: Dale Joseph Melczek (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NWI Times Chicago Tribune
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American Catholic bishop Dumelow (talk) 14:33, 30 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Joey DeFrancesco

[edit]
Article: Joey DeFrancesco (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NYT, NPR
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American jazz musician. --PFHLai (talk) 10:20, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Steven Hoffenberg

[edit]
Article: Steven Hoffenberg (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://bnonews.com/index.php/2022/08/steven-hoffenberg-worked-with-epstein-found-dead/
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American businessman and fraudster. Former owner of the New York Post. Found dead on this day. --PFHLai (talk) 06:46, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Giles Radice

[edit]
Article: Giles Radice (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian, The Times (paywalled obit with date of death)
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: British politician. The "writing and political ideas" section needs more sources. Fully sourced. Sunshineisles2 (talk) 01:22, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Re-posted) 2022 Angolan general election

[edit]
Proposed image
Article: 2022 Angolan general election (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Incumbent president João Lourenço (pictured) and his party the MPLA are declared winners of the general election in Angola. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ In the Angolan general election, the MPLA win the most seats and João Lourenço (pictured) is re-elected as president
News source(s): CNE, Guardian, Reuters, AlJazeera
Credits:

The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Nominator's comments: I realise I'm slightly early with the nomination but best to start tidying up now, with over 97% of votes counted, rather than having a lot to do later. I believe the article so far is very good: more background would be nice especially given the very long history of both the two biggest parties and the fears over potential vote rigging that were raised; once official results announced they need to be added and an aftermath section needs to be added too. Abcmaxx (talk) 20:56, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Robert E. Finnigan

[edit]
Article: Robert E. Finnigan (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): WSJ
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American engineer. Death announced in WP:RS on this date. Article might require an end-to-end read and some edits. I did not have to do any major edits. Article seems well built and seems ready for homepage / RD. Ktin (talk) 16:57, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 24

[edit]
August 24, 2022 (2022-08-24) (Wednesday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Health and environment

Law and crime

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Man of the Hole

[edit]
Article: Man of the Hole (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  In Brazil, an Indigenous tribe's last survivor of genocide, Man of the Hole, dies (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Man of the Hole, his tribe's last survivor of Indigenous genocide in Brazil dies
Alternative blurb II: ​ The last surviving member of a people destroyed in the genocide of Indigenous peoples in Brazil dies
Alternative blurb III: ​ The Man of the Hole, one of the last known survivors of the genocide of Indigenous peoples in Brazil, is found dead.
News source(s): The Guardian, BBC
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Last known member of an uncontacted Amazon tribe. Body found 24th August Dumelow (talk) 15:40, 29 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Dorli Rainey

[edit]
Article: Dorli Rainey (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NYT
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American activist. Died Aug 12 but announced Aug 24. Innisfree987 (talk) 19:26, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Tim Page (photographer)

[edit]
Article: Tim Page (photographer) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): AusBC, NYT, CNN, People Mag, WaPo, EuroWeekly, Telegraph, Guardian, Barron's, HistoryNet
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: British-Australian photographer and war correspondent. Wikibio still needs more footnotes, but it's getting there. --PFHLai (talk) 18:17, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Coradia iLint hydrail line

[edit]
Articles: Hydrail (talk · history · tag) and Alstom Coradia LINT (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Alstom inaugurates hydrail, the world's first fleet of hydrogen fuel-powered trains. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Coradia iLint train line in Lower Saxony becomes the world's first train line with a hydrail system.
Alternative blurb II: ​ The world's first hydrail train line system is inaugurated in Bremervörde, Lower Saxony.
News source(s): Al Jazeera, DW, Onet, CNN
Credits:

Nominator's comments: The world's first. Abcmaxx (talk) 11:37, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It was tested in 2018; not actually formally implemented.Abcmaxx (talk) 14:04, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
According to the DW link above, those two trains have been in passenger service for the entire four years, carrying fare-paying customers. That's not just a test, it's a small-scale deployment. Modest Genius talk 14:19, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Wayne Yates

[edit]
Article: Wayne Yates (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Commercial Appeal; WMC-TV (NBC); Memphis Tigers
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: First reported today (August 24); died on August 16. —Bloom6132 (talk) 09:53, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Kallistos (Ware)

[edit]
Article: Kallistos (Ware) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Orthodox Times
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Extremely prominent theologian and bishop of the Eastern Orthodox Church. Article needs work on referencing. Memory eternal! Ad Orientem (talk) 01:02, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Support, Article is good enough for RD. Alex-h (talk) 08:20, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I think everything is now sourced. -Ad Orientem (talk) 00:12, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Shalom Cohen

[edit]
Article: Shalom Cohen (rabbi) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Haaretz
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Rabbi and spiritual head of the Zionist Shas political party. EditMaker Me (talk) 11:39, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Len Dawson

[edit]
Article: Len Dawson (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): [11]
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: NFL player who is a Super Bowl MVP, first round draft pick, and Hall of Famer. Sportsfangnome (talk) 13:44, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 23

[edit]
August 23, 2022 (2022-08-23) (Tuesday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Health and environment

Law and crime

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Rolando Cubela Secades

[edit]
Article: Rolando Cubela Secades (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Telegraph
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Cuban revolutionary who planned to assassinate Fidel Castro. Article looks good. _-_Alsor (talk) 15:00, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Vytjie Mentor

[edit]
Article: Vytjie Mentor (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.ofm.co.za/article/centralsa/317728/northern-cape-s-mentor-passes-on-after-illness
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: South African politician. African National Congress's caucus chairperson (2004-2008). --PFHLai (talk) 07:00, 27 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Julian Robertson

[edit]
Article: Julian Robertson (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): WSJ, Fortune, Bloomberg, CNBC
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American hedge fund manager. - Indefensible (talk) 17:06, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Former Malaysian Prime Minister loses final appeal

[edit]
WP:NAC: Consensus to post is unlikely to develop. —Bloom6132 (talk) 22:46, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: Najib Razak (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Former Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Razak's final appeal against corruption charges is dismissed; he is sentenced to 12 years jail. (Post)
News source(s): Straits Times, AP, BBC, AlJazeera
Credits:

Article updated
Nominator's comments: 1Malaysia Development Berhad scandal is also a possible target article, although that article hasn't been updated. Banedon (talk) 09:02, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
What significant is that he was free on bail and never served his prison sentence until this case is finally heard in the Apex Court of Malaysia. Wilson C A 99 (talk) 15:52, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Posted) RD: Rahimuddin Khan

[edit]
Article: Rahimuddin Khan (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.thenews.com.pk/print/984738-balochistan-peacemaker-rahimuddin-khan-passes-away
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Pakistani military chief, provincial governor, major role as peacemaker for Baloch insurgency Buttoner (talk) 00:32, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Tom Springfield

[edit]
Article: Tom Springfield (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-08-23/the-seekers-songwriter-tom-springfield-dies-at-88/101359566
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Writer of songs that made The Seekers famous. Brother of Dusty Springfield. Died last month but only just announced. HiLo48 (talk) 00:32, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 22

[edit]
August 22, 2022 (2022-08-22) (Monday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Health and environment

International relations

Law and crime

(Posted) RD: Theo Sommer

[edit]
Article: Theo Sommer (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): FR and many others
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: First he was (foreign) political journalist of the leading German weekly Die Zeit, then editor-in-chief, then publisher (along with Marion Dönhoff and Helmut Schmidt), and he kept writing for life. The article so far had almost none of that but Nazi elite school and tax evasion. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:29, 24 August 2022 (UTC) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:29, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Gary Gaines

[edit]
Article: Gary Gaines (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CBS Sports
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: The inspiration for Billy Bob Thornton's role in Friday Night Lights. – Muboshgu (talk) 22:39, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Jerry Allison

[edit]
Article: Jerry Allison (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Rolling Stone, Stereogum
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Drummer and last surviving original member of Buddy Holly's Crickets, and writer of some of their most popular songs. Article needs updating and citations.  Doc StrangeMailboxLogbook 00:02, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: György Pásztor

[edit]
Article: György Pásztor (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): IIHF, Nemzetisport, Magyar Jegkorongszovetseg
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Recent death of an IIHF Hall of Fame inductee. Flibirigit (talk) 15:37, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Margaret Urlich

[edit]
Article: Margaret Urlich (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): New Zealand Herald, Radio New Zealand
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Mooonswimmer 14:18, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yangtze river dries

[edit]
Article: Yangtze (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ The Yangtze river dries up as a result of drought in China, causing a stop of supply in hydropower. (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

Article needs updating

Nominator's comments: One of the world's biggest rivers in one of the world's biggest economies. Needs updating. Abcmaxx (talk) 12:38, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Singapore repeals 377A

[edit]
Consensus to post unlikely to develop.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 12:47, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Articles: Section 377A of the Penal Code (Singapore) (talk · history · tag) and LGBT rights in Singapore (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Singapore announces plans to repeal Section 377A of the Penal Code, decriminalising sex between men in the country. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Prime minister Lee Hsien Loong announces Section 377A of the Penal Code will be repealed, decriminalising sex between men in Singapore.
Alternative blurb II: ​ Singapore announces plans to decriminalise sex between men.
News source(s): BBC; Straits Times; Reuters
Credits:
 Arcahaeoindris (talk) 09:35, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Hayat Hotel siege

[edit]
Article: 2022 Mogadishu hotel attack (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ In Mogadishu, more than 20 die when al-Shabaab insurgents storm and seize a hotel (Post)
News source(s): BBC; NYT; Al Jazeera; Reuters; The Hindu
Credits:

Nominator's comments: The article needs work but we have 10 projects on the job: WikiProject Automobiles, Crime, Disaster management, Explosives, Hotels, Islam, Military history, Serial Killer, Somalia and Terrorism! Andrew🐉(talk) 08:15, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Like the August 2022 Kabul mosque bombing - which had a similar death toll & wasn't nominated - it's unlikely to be expanded enough to be eligible to be posted, despite being notable enough. Jim Michael 2 (talk) 04:59, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
...or it's not notable at all and that's why no one will bother to update it? Seems like the free market at work here... --LaserLegs (talk) 09:57, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The lack of editors is due to a lack of interest in undeveloped countries, such as Afghanistan & Somalia. Had such things happened in the developed world, the articles would be several times longer, and several times more people would be editing them. How can attacks on civilian targets with death tolls of about 20 not be notable? Jim Michael 2 (talk) 11:55, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
FYI LaserLegs primary contribution to ITN is to whine about percieved anti-American bias (including over a non-blurbing RD of a black basketball legend he himself never bothered to support the nom of), bitch about European states 1/5th the size of the US and leave snarky conservative commentary on everything. So when are the admins here going to officially reprimand him for his disruptive bullshit? It's so blatant. --2A00:23C4:3E08:4001:F0C7:8374:3578:29D (talk) 12:38, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Actually I opposed posting Bill Russell as I do for almost all death blurbs and it was very bigoted of you to focus on the deceased race which should have no bearing on notability -- but hey, thanks for the personal attacks they cheer me up even more than actually reading these articles before commenting on their suitability. --LaserLegs (talk) 14:54, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
He did get a warning not too long ago for celebrating people getting killed crossing into Ceuta/Melilla. But yeah, the constant trolling and toxicity is rather offputting. Do as i say, not as i do seems to be the mantra. 91.96.25.143 (talk) 17:21, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Bus crashes in Turkey

[edit]
Consensus to post unlikely to develop. Regards SoWhy 15:45, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: 2022 Turkey bus crashes (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Two separate bus crashes in Turkey kill 35 people. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ 35 people are killed in two unrelated bus crashes in Turkey.
Alternative blurb II: ​ In Turkey, unrelated bus crashes leave 35 people dead.
News source(s): Wahington Post, The National, Al Jazeera
Credits:
 EditMaker Me (talk) 08:10, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's much more suited to DYK. Jim Michael 2 (talk) 20:01, 22 August 2022 (UTC)]'[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 21

[edit]
August 21, 2022 (2022-08-21) (Sunday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

International relations

Law and crime

Sports

(Posted) RD: Oliver Frey

[edit]
Article: Oliver Frey (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.filmstories.co.uk/news/oliver-frey-dies-aged-74/ , https://www.eurogamer.net/beauty-and-brutality-how-oliver-freys-art-defined-a-new-medium , https://www.gamedeveloper.com/culture/obituary-oliver-frey-illustrator-of-iconic-video-game-magazine-covers-has-passed-away
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: UK-based Swiss illustrator. Long enough (600+ words of prose.) Footnotes are deployed at expected spots. No issues with formatting. Earwig reports no troubles. This wikibio looks pretty much READY for RD to me. --PFHLai (talk) 10:45, 28 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Jim Mueller

[edit]
Article: Jim Mueller (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Cleveland.com
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Died on August 17, first announced at the Eagles-Browns preseason game on August 21 ("Jim Donovan ... announced news of his passing Sunday during the preseason game against the Eagles."). BeanieFan11 (talk) 20:08, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Zulu coronation

[edit]
Consensus to post unlikely to develop. Regards SoWhy 15:48, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Misuzulu Zulu (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Misuzulu ka Zwelithini (pictured) is crowned King of the Zulu Nation. (Post)
News source(s): BBC; NYT; The Times; Al Jazeera; ABC
Credits:
 Andrew🐉(talk) 20:21, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
P.S. I don't think we should be applying colonial bias to deciding which nations are worthy of inclusion. Polyamorph (talk) 07:58, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Colonial bias isn’t the problem here, the problem is that it’s simply put not a sovereign nation. Same reason we don’t include the elections/accessions of the Governor of New York or First Minister of Scotland. The Kip (talk) 19:42, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Is that an actual rule though? Colonial bias is an issue, because without colonialism they certainly would have a recognised sovereign nation of their own. Polyamorph (talk) 21:47, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
We don't deal in hypotheticals, only facts as they are. South Africa is the sovereign state here. The Kip (talk) 22:55, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Where is the rule it must be a sovereign state to be worthy of ITN? Polyamorph (talk) 01:51, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I’m not sure when you began on ITNR, but we use precedence per WP:ITNR. We almost never (really, if ever) post non-sovereign entities. If you’ve got a problem, open a discussion on the talk page. The Kip (talk) 03:19, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
OK, thank you. No I don't have a problem. I do think ITN could do more to cover indigenous nations so perhaps that is worth a discussion at some point. Polyamorph (talk) 05:57, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Coronation =/= succession. Polyamorph (talk) 14:08, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed. Succession is far more significant. Modest Genius talk 14:11, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed. When Charles ascends to the throne I expect us to blurb that (alongside the death or abdication of his mother, which would be the trigger). I wouldn't expect us to blurb his coronation though, which might take place a year or so later.  — Amakuru (talk) 08:59, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Why is it not important enough Tradedia? It's in the news and deemed sufficiently notable to have an independent article. What would be enough? Polyamorph (talk) 18:28, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Nevermind, it (the coronation) clearly doesn't have an independent article.Polyamorph (talk) 19:11, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
If someone had written a high-quality independent article on the coronation, I probably would've supported this blurb, as that's exactly the sort of thing that we would like to present in our ITN block. ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 08:50, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose There are a lot of different tribes and ethnic groups in Africa, many of which have an ongoing ceremonial leader, chief of king. The Zulu are quite well known for various reasons, but they're far from the only group in South Africa, let alone the continent as a whole and other areas of the world. I don't think it would be practical to post all of these in addition to national political leaders, or to attempt to decide which are the more "important", therefore it's more neutral not to post any of them.  — Amakuru (talk) 08:59, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose I find it interesting that this debate has been opened, but we have to be pragmatic and, as Amakuru says, in Africa there are many ethno-monarchical groups and including the Zulus would be a bad precedent. Perhaps we should have a more sensitive view of indigenous communities, but not in this way. Also, the succession occurred last year after the passing of Goodwill Zwelithini, it is now a mere ceremonial coronation. _-_Alsor (talk) 15:25, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Posted) RD: Darya Dugina

[edit]
Article: Darya Dugina (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  Darya Dugina, the daughter of the Russian philosopher Aleksandr Dugin, is killed by a car bomb in Moscow. (Post)
News source(s): BBC, ABC, WION, AP, CNN, Guardian, AFP
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: A lot of news coverage, but article orange-tagged and needs improving. EditMaker Me (talk) 12:38, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Wait – Widely covered, but significance questionable as her father, Alexander Dugin, a nationalist idealogue, was the likely target. – Sca (talk) 13:03, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose blurb / Support RD. "Daughter of influential guy is killed" is not the level of notability that is sufficient for ITN, especially since it's not that surprising that someone might have had issue with the guy who is partly responsible for that disastrous situation Russia finds itself in. Article looks good enough for RD now though. Regards SoWhy 13:23, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Blurb and RD Subject's notability beyond just her death has already been questioned and the article could end up being moved and no longer be a biographical article. DarkSide830 (talk) 16:18, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comments: The proposed blurb saying "the daughter of..." is already indicating that the deceased is not notable enough on her own. So, let's forget about blurbing this news story. It may be ok as an RD nom, but the wikibio is short (barely 400 words) and could use more info on her life -- any examples of her "misdeeds" that got her sanctioned so early? What misinformation did she spread before the war? If she was not notable enough before the car bomb exploded, her wikibio may not survive an AfD. --PFHLai (talk) 19:28, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    • She said the same things her father said, genocidal 'fantasies', although uncertain if they can still be called fantasies. She visited the Azovstal ruins in Mariupol and said some very nasty things, and she did before the war as well. Her vitriol was hosted by russian state TV i believe. But i am uncertain how much of that is actually covered in RS, i had seen clips of it though. I did a search for her name after i read the news 30 minutes after it happened, and very little came up. Guess RS hadn't taken much of an interest in her up to now. But she was sanctioned for dealing in misinformation/propaganda, in her own right and not as her fathers daughter. Very active in the european far-right from what i could gather. 188.118.188.76 (talk) 20:13, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose blurb, Support RD Lacks significant notability beyond circumstances of death. The Kip (talk) 20:47, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted as RD Stephen 06:14, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Post-posting comment – Guess who the Russians blame? – why, Ukraine of course. [14] [15] [16] – Sca (talk) 12:36, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Usyk vs Joshua

[edit]
Consensus to post unlikely to develop. Regards SoWhy 07:58, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Proposed image
Article: Oleksandr Usyk vs Anthony Joshua II (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ In boxing's Rage on the Red Sea, Oleksandr Usyk (pictured) beats Anthony Joshua for 5 world heavyweight titles (Post)
News source(s): BBC; NYT; Guardian; Straits Times; Al Jazeera
Credits:
Nominator's comments: Usyk is Ukrainian which gives this some extra impact. The first women to fight in Saudi Arabia also made news. Andrew🐉(talk) 11:08, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 20

[edit]
August 20, 2022 (2022-08-20) (Saturday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

Law and crime

(Posted) RD: Nayyara Noor

[edit]
Article: Nayyara Noor (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Indian Express Dawn
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Pakistani singer. Article needs some work including referencing. If someone has a few cycles, chip right-in. Ktin (talk) 15:55, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Kate Holbrook

[edit]
Article: Kate Holbrook (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Salt Lake Tribune; Deseret News
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Bloom6132 (talk) 22:43, 23 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 19

[edit]
August 19, 2022 (2022-08-19) (Friday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

Law and crime

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Michael Malone (author)

[edit]
Article: Michael Malone (author) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Washington Post; The News & Observer; Publishers Weekly
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Bloom6132 (talk) 07:32, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: John Wockenfuss

[edit]
Article: John Wockenfuss (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Detroit Free Press
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Former MLB player and minor league manager. This wikibio is obviously long enough (1900+ words of prose), but could benefit from some re-writing and re-organization (Intro a bit messy. Main prose has too many short paragraphs starting with his surname...). --PFHLai (talk) 20:04, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Carl Kabat

[edit]
Article: Carl Kabat (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The New York Times
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Catholic priest, anti-nuclear activist. Karat spent 17 years of his life in jail for his protest actions. NY Times obit published 19 August. Thriley (talk) 21:06, 20 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Oppose on quality article needs sources, his nationality is not mentioned, nor is the country (cities and states) in which the events take place. We should not assume that everyone knows that Pennsylvania and Texas are in the United States._-_Alsor (talk) 22:06, 20 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Riddick Parker

[edit]
Article: Riddick Parker (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Richmond Times-Dispatch; WTVR-TV; WWBT
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Bloom6132 (talk) 10:48, 20 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Josephine Tewson

[edit]
Article: Josephine Tewson (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC News Sky News ITV News, Guardian
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 RobynRhi (talk) 17:18, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 18

[edit]
August 18, 2022 (2022-08-18) (Thursday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

International relations

Law and crime

Politics and elections

2022 European derecho

[edit]
Article: 2022 European derecho (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ A derecho in southern Europe causes 12 deaths and winds of nearly 140 miles per hour (230 km/h). (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ A derecho in southern Europe causes 12 deaths and winds of over 220 kilometres per hour (140 mph)
News source(s): Washington Post
Credits:

Nominator's comments: Rare European derecho with high death toll 142.243.254.224 (talk) 14:47, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment Article is too short and devoid of anything but just what happened. Is this potentially related to the heat wave in Europe?, as I really can't see how this can be expanded much and if it is part of the heat wave, it could be covered there. --Masem (t) 15:16, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Unfortunately it isn’t. A derecho just just super long-tracking storm system, and this one just happen to be a super rare and near record-breaking level. Derecho’s are uncommon either (List of derecho events), but in Europe, one that rivals the fast wind speeds of the yearly/multi-yearly US ones is super rare. Elijahandskip (talk) 17:51, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
You must be thinking of gecko. Or maybe Dreck. -- Sca (talk) 22:26, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
List of derecho events. Very common in the US (Yearly or multi-yearly events). Elijahandskip (talk) 17:51, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
"Derecho" wasn't English before, sure, but "hurricane winds" is clearly fugazi now. "Hurricane force winds" is a bit more accurate, but way too long. AP needs to wise up to WP, not vice versa. InedibleHulk (talk) 02:35, 20 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
"AP needs to wise up to WP" - umm no, that would be WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS. We aren't here to set any trends or influence how others present things.  — Amakuru (talk) 13:10, 20 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's no great wrong, and nothing new; the English Wikipedia has been telling the world what derechos are since August 2004. Many British adult netizens were legit offline born into this world. You and Sca are trying to wrong that great right, from my perspective. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:05, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Norah Vincent

[edit]
Article: Norah Vincent (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NYT (paywalled)
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Writer. She died on July 6, but as far as I can tell, her death was not reported anywhere until this NYT obit today. Some of the article is fine but the section about her second book (Voluntary Madness) needs work. Sunshineisles2 (talk) 20:39, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Hanae Mori

[edit]
Article: Hanae Mori (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The New York Times, Guardian
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Death published today Thriley (talk) 13:15, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 17

[edit]
August 17, 2022 (2022-08-17) (Wednesday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

International relations

Law and crime

Science and technology

(Closed) Nadir crater

[edit]
SPEEDY CLOSE
Consensus to post is not likely to emerge. - Fuzheado | Talk 04:06, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Nadir crater (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Scientists announce the discovery of eight kilometer-wide undersea Nadir crater in the Atlantic Ocean. (Post)
News source(s): CNN, BBC, Science Advances
Credits:

Article updated
Nominator's comments: Believed to be of impact nature, but in any case the discovery of such large Earth features looks significant. Peer-reviewed article is out. Brandmeistertalk 09:48, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – I would like to see the article expanded a bit more first, but this looks very promising. Would be a really interesting article to blurb! ~Maplestrip/Mable (chat) 10:04, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose. The peer-reviewed paper describes it as a candidate impact crater, because the evidence is very incomplete. In addition, the date is highly uncertain - it's quite likely this isn't related to Chicxulub at all. At present this is just a proposal with some circumstantial hints, which IMO makes it unsuitable for ITN. (Theses issues should also be described in our article.) Modest Genius talk 10:14, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per Modest Genius. This is just a claim by a group of scientists published in a reputable peer-reviewed journal awaiting verification/refutation by other scientists in the field. That's how science works. That the media publish a modified version in a clickbait-oriented manner is completely irrelevant.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 12:27, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose The "newsworthy" part of this is the possible connection to the dinosaur mass extinction event, but that's not yet proven, only that these feature exists in the ocean. --Masem (t) 12:36, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose - Granted, scientific discoveries rarely take the form of gigantic breakthroughs. Instead, they are gradual, halting steps as a hypothesis is posited, repeatedly tested, and then eventually subsumed into standing scientific consensus. This is not good as far as ITN is concerned when we want to give attention to these minority topics, but the lack of a definitive moment-of-truth prevents us from publicizing stories such as these. Perhaps ITN and science news are just incompatible.--🌈WaltCip-(talk) 13:05, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's even more galling, I think, when you consider the fact that every single item currently on the ITN template right now currently involves death, or an attempt to cause death. --🌈WaltCip-(talk) 13:37, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
This item would be about death and disaster too. Looking at the BBC News currently, the main alternative I'm seeing is Girls just wanna have fun.... But note that the Japanese government is following this "party on, dudes!" trend too... Andrew🐉(talk) 14:26, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Last month we posted science blurbs including the first JWST images, Chinese paddlefish extinction, and the Fields medal (OK that's maths, but pretty close to science). ITN does feature scientific stories from time to time - big breakthroughs do happen, albeit not as often as disasters and elections. Modest Genius talk 15:29, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Notable scientific discovery This post was made by orbitalbuzzsaw gang (talk) 13:07, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose per Modest Genius and Masem. _-_Alsor (talk) 15:04, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose There have been many claimed impact craters that lack definitive evidence that have turned out not to be true, which I have spent a lot of time cleaning up. In this case, there is no definitive confirmation that this is indeed an impact crater. This is merely a first step in confirming/disproving whether this structure is an impact crater. Hemiauchenia (talk) 18:03, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose The article is sourced a single peer reviewed, but nevertheless primary, research paper from the group that made the discovery. There is a CNN reference in the article, and some other news organisations have picked up the story, no doubt originating from a press release to promote the groups new Science Advances paper. Nice paper, but needs wider coverage beyond the authors of this original study and associated stories released to the press. Polyamorph (talk) 20:46, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Closed) Defteros v. Google LLC

[edit]
Consensus unlikely to emerge. Regards SoWhy 15:26, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: Defteros v. Google LLC (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ The High Court of Australia rules that Google is not a publisher and therefore cannot be liable for defamatory material. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ The High Court of Australia finds that Google is not the publisher of its search results and therefore is not liable for defamatory material therein.
News source(s): ABC, Axios
Credits:

Article updated
Nominator's comments: This is worldwide news, ruled by an Australian court but potential implications everywhere given Google is used everywhere. I have only just started the article now, so bare bones at the moment but plenty of more sources available to add to article; any help very welcome! Abcmaxx (talk) 14:41, 17 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 16

[edit]
August 16, 2022 (2022-08-16) (Tuesday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

Law and crime

Politics and elections

RD: Duggie Brown

[edit]
Article: Duggie Brown (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC, Guardian
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: English comedian and actor. Wikibio not yet ready and needs quite a bit more referencing. --PFHLai (talk) 15:20, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Charley Frazier

[edit]
Article: Charley Frazier (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): [20]
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 – Muboshgu (talk) 20:25, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Eva-Maria Hagen

[edit]
Article: Eva-Maria Hagen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): SZ
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: German actress and singer Grimes2 (talk) 14:05, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Matti Lehtinen

[edit]
Article: Matti Lehtinen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): HS
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Centenarian Finnish operatic baritone and voice teacher of international fame. Article was deleted once by BBB23 who perhaps knows more. Some bits are not yet referenced, but I need to go for the day. The Finnish-speaking updaters were already of great help! The English ref is a (bad) translation of the Finnish, which may help. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 05:31, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Mark Girouard

[edit]
Article: Mark Girouard (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Telegraph
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Thriley (talk) 22:04, 17 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Wolfgang Petersen

[edit]
Article: Wolfgang Petersen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: German film-maker, best known as the director of Das Boot and Air Force One. Source given is about news of his death; died from pancreatic cancer on 12 August 2022 but only announced publicly on 16 August 2022. Article only requires a few more citations before posting. Abcmaxx (talk) 23:29, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

 Done Grimes2 (talk) 11:01, 17 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Steve Grimmett

[edit]
Article: Steve Grimmett (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Frontman of metal band Grim Reaper. Source given is about news of his death. Article requires big clean-up, nominating to draw attention to it. Abcmaxx (talk) 23:17, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Darius Campbell Danesh

[edit]
Article: Darius Campbell Danesh (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 2A00:23C7:2B86:9801:391E:E97D:7240:73C4 (talk) 15:52, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Support Article seems good to post XxLuckyCxX (talk) 16:59, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support, - Have added some additional sources Mark E (talk) 08:33, 17 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 15

[edit]
August 15, 2022 (2022-08-15) (Monday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Health and environment

International relations

Law and crime

Politics and elections

Sports

(Posted) RD: Pete Carril

[edit]
Article: Pete Carril (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The New York Times; The Washington Post; Princeton University
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Bloom6132 (talk) 05:11, 18 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) FIFA sanctions Indian FA

[edit]
(NON-ADMIN CLOSURE)
Consensus to post not likely to emerge. Thanks for the nomination. Ktin (talk) 14:58, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.


Article: All India Football Federation (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ FIFA suspends the AIFF, stripping India of its international football hosting rights (Post)
News source(s): Deutsche Welle
Credits:

Article needs updating
Nominator's comments: Article needs updating but otherwise it's well written. Abcmaxx (talk) 08:18, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I've updated the AIFF article now. Well they cannot qualify the Asian Championships or the World Cup, fairly significant for the most/2nd most populous nation in the world's most widely played and watched sport. Abcmaxx (talk) 11:19, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
@Gotitbro: as far as I understand it, government interference most likely. I didn't want to assume anything, I just put what the sources said. Abcmaxx (talk) 08:04, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Frederick Buechner

[edit]
Article: Frederick Buechner (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NYT
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Prodigious author, Pulitzer and National Book Award finalist, O. Henry Award winner. I haven't edited/updated the article, but is comprehensive and seems well-sourced. QatarStarsLeague (talk) 01:10, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Nicholas Evans

[edit]
Article: Nicholas Evans (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Bookseller
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Best known as the author of The Horse Whisperer. Died on 9 August 2022 following a heart attack at the age of 72, but death announced publicly on 15 August 2022. Article needs expansion and further citations before posting. Abcmaxx (talk) 18:40, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Lenny Johnrose

[edit]
Article: Lenny Johnrose (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC Sport
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Ex-Bury & Burnley football midfielder died aged 52, five years after motor neurone disease diagnosis. Source given is about news of his death. Article needs expansion and further citations before posting. Abcmaxx (talk) 18:30, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) 2022 Kenyan general election

[edit]
Proposed image
Article: 2022 Kenyan general election (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ William Ruto (pictured) is elected President of Kenya. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ William Ruto (pictured) is elected President of Kenya, defeating Raila Odinga
Alternative blurb II: ​ Kenya's incumbent Deputy President, William Ruto (pictured) declared president-elect in spite of chaotic scenes and dismissal by the losing party led by Raila Odinga and some members of the electoral committee.
Alternative blurb III: ​ William Ruto (pictured) is announced to be elected as President of Kenya, which is challenged by opposition candidate Raila Odinga.
News source(s): BBC, Sky News, Reuters, AP, France 24, AlJazeera, DW, CNN, The Independent
Credits:

Article updated
The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Nominator's comments: Dramatic election once again, in one of Africa’s most vibrant democracies BastianMAT (talk) 15:32, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support - Major news EvergreenFir (talk) 15:34, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - firstly, the individual should not be a bolded link, the news item is the election only, as per all other elections worldwide (e.g. the last US election, in which Joe Biden was not bolded). Secondly, there needs to be a prose update in the linked article detailing what happened, as we would expect for any election or event of this nature. 2017_Kenyan_general_election#President at least has a few sentences explaining how things unfolded and who won. Thirdly, and this probably isn't an issue at this stage as reliable sources are reporting that Ruto is president-elect, but there's some controversy going on around this. Four of the electoral commissioners have disowned the result that their own chairman has announced, and it is very likely that the result will go to the Supreme Court in the next week or two, to air whatever issues those commissioners plus the losers of the election may have to say. I'm not sure what would happen if we report this as news now, then have to announce something different further down the line if there's a re-run for example... (as there was in 2017). Food for thought anyway.  — Amakuru (talk) 15:55, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Needs update. I agree with Amakuru that the bold link should be to the election, not Ruto. The content already in the election article is good and adequately referenced, but it doesn't have any prose on the results. Needs some textual description, reaction, aftermath etc. - especially if the opponents have said they intend to appeal. Modest Genius talk 17:05, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    24 hours later, no prose on the results has been added to the article. Modest Genius talk 16:12, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Support original blurb (not the alts). There's now several paragraphs of reaction, explaining the messy announcement and intention to appeal. I'm not sure that section is entirely neutral, but the overall article is good enough to post. Modest Genius talk 12:40, 17 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak oppose for now per Modest Genius. Lack of prose in the "Preliminary results" section (which preliminary seems not to be anymore) and a section on reactions/aftermath is missing. That they are challenged before the Supreme Court is a consequence of the elections, which by themselves are INTR. _-_Alsor (talk) 17:20, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose I just listened to a report on BBC Radio and the result didn't sound reliable – a week to count the votes; violence at the announcement and election officials disowning the result. Andrew🐉(talk) 17:26, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    The results have been reported by the Independent Electoral and Boundaries Commission. The reliability of this commission and of the results of the elections must be assumed, no matter how much there are opponents who reject them or may "smell bad" the counts. Saying what you say, it would exclude from being ITNR the elections in many countries, especially in Africa, and we've already said on several occasions that it's not up to us to make this judgment. _-_Alsor (talk) 17:41, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Yes, but in this case four members of the actual IEBC you cite have disowned the reported result. Although for as yet unspecified reasons. It's not just the opposition candidates. However, the crucial point is that reliable sources are calling the result a Ruto win, so for that purpose we can regard the result as final for now, pending any further supreme court decision which might be made in the future.  — Amakuru (talk) 18:21, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Exactly. In the same way as was done with the American presidential elections: when reliable sources announced the results, these were already taken for firm. It would be ITNR-worthy (IMO) in the event that the Supreme Court invalidates the results and a general election has to be held again in Kenya. _-_Alsor (talk) 21:56, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – Follow the RS reports. – Sca (talk) 19:41, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • The BBC is the reliable source I'm reading and it says, "Four of the seven members of the electoral commission refused to endorse the result, saying it was "opaque". ... Kenya's history of disputed elections in the past have led to violence or the whole process election being cancelled. ... The Kenyan Supreme Court annulled the last election ...". As we are an encyclopedia, not a newspaper, there's no rush and so it would be prudent to wait a while and see how this works out. Andrew🐉(talk) 22:27, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    The BBC also says Ruto won. It’s not up to us to judge whether the election was free and fair, only to post the results. The Kip (talk) 23:19, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Denise Dowse

[edit]
Article: Denise Dowse (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CNN
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

August 14

[edit]
August 14, 2022 (2022-08-14) (Sunday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

(Posted) RD: Déwé Gorodey

[edit]
Article: Déwé Gorodey (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Le Monde, TV5Monde
Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: New Caledonian teacher, writer, feminist and politician. PFHLai (talk) 06:11, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

2022 Yerevan explosion

[edit]
Article: 2022 Yerevan explosion (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Six people are killed, 60 others injured and 18 more are missing or trapped under rubble in an explosion at a fireworks storage area of a mall in Yerevan, Armenia. (Post)
News source(s): (Al Jazeera)
Credits:

Article needs updating

Nominator's comments: Major world news. Abcmaxx (talk) 19:55, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed blurb. Abcmaxx (talk) 08:20, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose on quality If someone is able to translate the Armenian equivalent article to help expand the article then that would be helpful XxLuckyCxX (talk) 18:40, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Pueblos Unidos cartel is broken up

[edit]
Article: Mexican drug war (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ The Pueblos Unidos cartel is disbanded after 164 armed members are sucessfully ambushed by police in Michoacán, Mexico. (Post)
News source(s): Poland The Times, 24 News Recorder, Yahoo! Noticias, Grupo Marmor
Credits:

Article needs updating

Nominator's comments: Major event where 146 gang members are arrested, with 142 assault rifles, 42 pistols, and a 28 vehicle convoy captured in one move, disbanding whole (albeit smaller) cartel. Could not find the article to this cartel but likely has another name? Article needs updating too. Abcmaxx (talk) 19:37, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) Giza church fire

[edit]
Article: Giza church fire (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ At least 41 people are killed and 45 others injured after a Coptic church complex including a nursery catches fire in Giza, Egypt. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ A fire at a Coptic church in Giza, Egypt kills 41 people, including several children.
News source(s): (BBC News), AP, Reuters, France24, AlJazeera
Credits:

Article updated

Nominator's comments: Breaking news so obviously article is only one line long at the moment. Abcmaxx (talk) 15:26, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thats just based on the assessment on the talk page though. Id say this is start class at least at this point. Ill see what I can find for background without resorting to synth though, but id expect it to take some time for that type of analysis tying together past events to happen here. nableezy - 17:46, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
And done, this would now meet the DYK requirements for length (524 words, 3258 characters of readable prose) to post as well. nableezy - 18:01, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - the title of the article is very generic; arguably it should be merged into the parent article of the subject church, which also should be updated. The blurb needs to link the article as well, currently it does not meet posting requirements. - Indefensible (talk) 17:47, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed on the title, added altblurb to address those issues. nableezy - 18:01, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Dont think that matters tbh, but I *think* I have the correct location now, but either way until its verified can just keep that out. We have a name and neighborhood, dont need exact coordinates. nableezy - 19:12, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
There is no need to rush, this is an encyclopedia and not a news site. - Indefensible (talk) 19:13, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Im not rushing, but the article does not have a wikilink to a church or coordinates, not having that isnt all that important. The confusion you speak of is now just on the talk page, and it shouldnt matter for our purposes here now. nableezy - 19:16, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Freya

[edit]
Article: Freya (walrus) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NRK
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Count Iblis (talk) 13:34, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

... due to recent expansion, we are now at 662 words. And to those skeptical in regards to article creation, there really are several sources dating to 2021, we just did not have an article up until now. Which totally makes sense if you think about it, it only became WP:NOTNEWS due to the continued press coverage months later. --LordPeterII (talk) 21:42, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support "Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post". Andrew🐉(talk) 20:46, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Keep in mind that there was no WP article until today about the walrus, thus the above issues related to length and notability are 100% fair game to consider. Most of that has been resolved since but we still will raise questions of notability of an article created on the same day as the death if it is short and/or lacking sourcing. Masem (t) 22:51, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    That's what WP:AFD is for. If you or anyone else doubts the notability, that's how to go about asserting the concern. The Rambling Man (Keep wearing the mask...) 22:52, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    If we tagged it for AFD that would 1) be pointy (given that there were editors sayign they were working on expanding it) and 2) disqualify the article for ITN posting while the AFD tag sat there. The reason to make sure that there's enough content for a freshly created article that is then put to be on RD is to make sure that it meets our quality expectations (500 words min, using reasonable sourcing) If for some reason that a new article couldn't get to those levels, then yes, an AFD would be required. It's just the claim "oh, there's a standalone, we must post" is not how we operate, we're still evaluating the quality of the standalone for posting. That's not an automatic blind thing that Andrew is suggesting. --Masem (t) 22:59, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I am fully aware of all this. Yet an article with sufficient coverage existed, sufficient notability was asserted, no-one had AFD'ed it. So that's just time to move on. By the time Andrew made his vote, all the boxes were checked. There was literally nothing else to be concerned about. Feels like there's some wonkery afoot here, "a freshly created article" caveat. Nein danke. The Rambling Man (Keep wearing the mask...) 23:05, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support article is reasonable enough, covers the death of a notable animal, nothing much more to debate here unless someone wants to take the article to WP:AFD of course, otherwise, hurry up and post. The Rambling Man (Keep wearing the mask...) 21:46, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted. --PFHLai (talk) 22:28, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Vinayak Mete

[edit]
Article: Vinayak Mete (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Indian Express
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Article needs more information to be added as well as citations for some of the information it currently contains. Hopefully this nomination leads to the fixing of these issues. EditMaker Me (talk) 12:38, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Ongoing: 2022 European heat waves

[edit]
Article: 2022 European heat waves (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item nomination (Post)
News source(s): Washington Post, The Guardian, World Health Organization
Credits:

Nominator's comments: This is an important current topic linked to the 2022 Oder environmental disaster, 2022 European drought, Climate change in Europe and 2022 European and Mediterranean wildfires and includes the 2022 United Kingdom heat wave. Munci (talk) 10:36, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

PS: ID sources per usual format, please. – Sca (talk)
This is my first time suggesting something for ITN so I am not sure what you mean. I did try and follow the instructions. Munci (talk) 17:27, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
See other nom's re sources. -- Sca (talk) 22:42, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I suppose we could put 2022 heat waves instead. Munci (talk) 10:13, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
That article has the same basic problem, as a hodgepodge of concluded events. InedibleHulk (talk) 18:08, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • On closer examination, this article also sucks. Of the five "August heat wave" sections, only Ireland's mentions a heatwave (maxed at 31, only water-related deaths, but still). The others are single high temperatures or slightly broader predictions. InedibleHulk (talk) 01:00, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Firstly, I do not see an issue with simply putting up specific notable heat waves for nomination. I think just having had one rise to the level of individual nomination is not enough to consider this for ongoing - if a second posted heat wave occurs, the perhaps we should consider this for ongoing. Beyond that, the organization of the article is poor. The article stratifies by country, but even under each country specific waves are not specified, and it is not specified in many cases the wave in question associated with the statements provided in the article. Just seems like a lot of information thrown together randomly - information that may be useful, but not as much so without context. DarkSide830 (talk) 03:24, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment from proposer Equivalent articles are ongoing on the French and German versions of Wikipedia. Munci (talk) 10:13, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – Possibly relevant: "Global heating has caused ‘shocking’ changes in forests across the Americas." – Sca (talk) 12:08, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Two different continents, three studies from the 2010s and no mention of heat waves, but yeah, possibly. InedibleHulk (talk) 18:22, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment As per Count Iblis I think the drought is more notable, and also ongoing. I mean, heatwaves we have had some in recent years, but c'mon, from that article's lede: The European Commission has warned that it will be Europe's worst drought in 500 years (!) – that's something, if indeed no rain is to come soon. We in Europe are not California, that's really new to us. --LordPeterII (talk) 18:15, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
That could indeed be an alternative. Munci (talk) 08:32, 17 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Rakesh Jhunjhunwala

[edit]
Article: Rakesh Jhunjhunwala (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NDTV, BBC, CNN
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Indian business executive. Article requires some work before it can be ready for homepage / RD. Ktin (talk) 04:19, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment: Needs copyediting (" first big profit", "Rakesh felt some uneasiness in his health, due to which he was rushed to Breach Candy Hospital", etc.); CN tags to be dealt with; a little more clarity throughout (he was investigated for insider trading but paid SEBI - an abbreviation not defined in the article - money; was that a settlement without admission of guilt?); use of currency symbols should be standardized throughout. Career section needs further details about what specifically he invested in: stocks, real estate? SpencerT•C 16:30, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Two {cn} tags remaining in the Career section, plus another for his accounting training. The rest of the wikipage looks OK. Please add more REFs. --PFHLai (talk) 19:43, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Ongoing removal: 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine

[edit]
Snow closing this discussion as consensus is very unlikely to develop. (non-admin closure) EditMaker Me (talk) 05:31, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item removal (Post)
Nominator's comments: There hasn't anything major happening for months since this was first posted in February. Unless something major happens, it should be removed. Interstellarity (talk) 00:09, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Just because nothing of note has occured recently doesn't mean it's over. Russia's still there. MyriadSims (talk) 01:08, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose As above XxLuckyCxX (talk) 02:50, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 13

[edit]
August 13, 2022 (2022-08-13) (Saturday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

Law and crime

Sports

  • Romanian swimmer David Popovici breaks the 13-year-old world record for the 100m freestyle with a time of 46.86. (SwimSwam)

(Posted) RD: Steve Worster

[edit]
Article: Steve Worster (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ESPN
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 – Muboshgu (talk) 16:52, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Maung Paw Tun

[edit]
Article: Maung Paw Tun (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Voice of Myanmar, Global News Light of Myanmar
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Htanaungg (talk) 08:40, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 12

[edit]
August 12, 2022 (2022-08-12) (Friday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

Law and crime

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Anshu Jain

[edit]
Article: Anshu Jain (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Money Control (India)
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Banker / Business executive. I will work on the article shortly. RIP. Did not require any major edits. Good to go in current state imo. RIP. Ktin (talk) 13:19, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) 2022 Oder environmental disaster

[edit]
Article: 2022 Oder environmental disaster (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ A mass die-off of fish, beavers and other wildlife occurs in the Oder river in Poland, likely due to mercury poisoning, causing a health and environmental crisis in large parts of the country. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ A mass die-off of wildlife in the Oder river causes a health and environmental crisis in large parts of Poland.
News source(s): Sky News, Reuters, ABC, Yahoo!, Planeta, Onet, TVN24, DW (English)
Credits:

Nominator's comments: A whole ecosystem has been wiped out along half the country and likely affect Germany too. They found several tons of dead wildlife in the river which stretches 840km. Protests among the local population already. Needs article. Abcmaxx (talk) 21:23, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment Do you have a main article for this event? I don't think we can post it if there isn't a base article for it & I don't think the section in the Oder article is long enough to warrant a post XxLuckyCxX (talk) 21:41, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@XxLuckyCxX: I couldn't find one, was hoping this nomination would help. If there isn't one then I can create 2022 Oder environmental disaster. Abcmaxx (talk) 21:44, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I see some updating at Oder#Contamination_in_2022. Let's call this article the nominated article for now. --PFHLai (talk) 22:14, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) 2022 Cetinje shooting

[edit]
Article: 2022 Cetinje shooting (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ A mass shooting after a family conflict in Cetinje, Montenegro, leaves 11 people dead and 6 others injured. (Post)
News source(s): WP, NDTV, The Guardian
Credits:

Article updated

Nominator's comments: Very rare mass shooting in a small European country; reported worldwide. Abcmaxx (talk) 21:12, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I may be wrong, but I think this may be the country's worst shooting ever (granted independent not that long, and small population, but still) Abcmaxx (talk) 21:42, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Also its not the motive that's the notable part, it is the rarity, location and scale of the tragedy surely. I am unconvinced this would be more notable if 11 people died because the perpetrator was a terrorist.Abcmaxx (talk) 22:01, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's routine when the death toll reaches a certain threshold relative to other mass shootings in the same country, or in cases where there is something particularly noteworthy about the details surrounding what happened (e.g. elementary school children were the victims). We don't post every single mass shooting in the US, even ones with a moderately high death toll, because of how common they are—but we do still post many of them. Same goes for Iraq back when it was being suicide-bombed on the regular. Kurtis (talk) 04:30, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I dont think thats true, and I think the yawning fellow up above must actually be asleep to have blacked out his constant repetitive opposes to any mass shooting in the United States, opposes that have largely carried the day. We rarely post mass shootings in the US, and the claim that we do routinely is bs. nableezy - 20:42, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support The worst mass shooting in the area ever (not only in country’s history) is something that merits inclusion. I really don’t understand the hangers-on to the notion that domestic incidents are inferior to terrorist attacks. We should be more pragmatic and look at the consequences in first place.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 22:37, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - widely covered in major sources around the world, seems like an obvious reason to support. nableezy - 22:48, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Mass shootings in Montenegro are not usual. Being the worst ever in this country/area makes it ITNR-worthy without any doubt. _-_Alsor (talk) 22:50, 12 August 2022 (UTC)p[reply]
  • Support and endorse Kiril Simeonovski's criticism of the apparent hierarchy being applied by other users. GenevieveDEon (talk) 23:10, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Well, we generally post mass shootings which have left 11 people dead in the US. Seems reasonable to post this one. Although oddly, it's not showing up on the BBC's front page, or Reuters. -- RockstoneSend me a message! 00:40, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted. My first time doing an ITN update; please let me know if I've done anything wrong. -- Tamzin[cetacean needed] (she|they|xe) 08:41, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • post-posting comment: i am not sure if "after a family conflict" is an appropriate description for the shooting. earlier reports, including the one from the guardian referenced in the nomination, mention a "family dispute", but later reports, such as this reuters source, appear to have been avoiding that description. the reuters source reports that a police director stated that the family killed was "staying at the house of the shooter as tenants", and the description of the victims in the bolded article in the blurb seems to confirm this. dying (talk) 10:09, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    DW,quoting Montenegrin public broadcaster RTCG, also refers to a family dispute. -- Sca (talk) 12:27, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    i agree that previous reports mentioned a "family dispute", as i stated above. however, my point is that the story appears to have changed.
    • compare this earlier rtcg report ("Saznajemo da je tragediji prethodio porodični sukob") with this more recent one ("Policija nema saznanja, niti je prijavljivano, da su postojali raniji konflkti [sic], niti napad u posljednjem periodu Borilovića na porodicu podstanara").
    • alternatively, compare this version of a report from the new york times ("the attack ... came after a family dispute") with an updated version of the same article ("The gunman first targeted the mother and her two children, who were tenants staying on his property").
    • the english dw article you linked has clearly not been updated ("the violence started while the attacker was arguing with his family members"), while the german dw article casts doubt on the earlier description of the dispute ("Warum er sie erschossen hat, ist bislang völlig unklar. Medien berichteten von einem 'Familienstreit'.").
    as the article has been updated, the itn blurb appears to no longer be supported by the article. stating that a dispute is a "family dispute" suggests that the dispute is within one family (as otherwise, perhaps all disputes are family disputes), and the updated article makes it clear that the shooter borilović was not a member of the family martinović. dying (talk) 20:34, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Post-posting support The article remains up to date. --Vacant0 (talk) 13:55, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

According to above comments, it seems that "family dispute" may be misleading. That should be removed from the blurb. Remember BLP. In general blurbs often are lengthier than they need to be. Omit needless words. --47.147.118.55 (talk) 04:12, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) Salman Rushdie stabbing

[edit]
Article: Stabbing of Salman Rushdie (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Booker Prize-winning author Sir Salman Rushdie, sentenced to death for blasphemy by an Iranian fatwa in 1989, is stabbed in the neck in Chautauqua, New York. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Salman Rushdie, author of the 1988 imaginary tale The Satanic Verses, widely decried by Islamicists, is stabbed in the neck in Chautauqua, N.Y. (U.S.A.)
News source(s): New York Times (paywalled), AP, BBC, Reuters, AlJazeera
Credits:

Article updated

Nominator's comments: To me this is one of the most important news items of the decade,comparable to the 1989 Iranian fatwa sentencing him to death for blasphemy. (Redacted) Tlhslobus (talk) 20:07, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Support as nom.Tlhslobus (talk) 20:07, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That isn't necessary; your support is already assumed. -- Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:20, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, though in my case it shouldn't be assumed, if only because I once nominated an item without being sure whether I was in favour of posting, as distinct from being in favour of having a discussion on whether it should be posted (which logically is all that a nomination really implies). Tlhslobus (talk) 20:33, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment There is a stub article, Stabbing of Salman Rushdie, but that currently gives less information than Salman_Rushdie#Chautauqua_attack_(2022). -- Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:20, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose assuming he survives the operations post-attack (which it sounds like he will). If he dies from it, a blurb may be appropriate as that's 100% an unusual death, but as an attack that he survives, it's a minor footnote. --Masem (t) 20:24, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose It's not even one of the most important stories of the week, let alone the decade (unless he dies, of course). Oh, and your nom statement is offensive to Muslims, even if the "woke" part of it makes it laughable. Black Kite (talk) 20:33, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    A prize-winning novelist who has had a foreign government calling for his death for years, is stabbed repeatedly and is now on a ventilator, has a damaged liver and may lose an eye. Not all those details were known when you wrote the above but still, "not even one of the important stories of the week" seems way off to me. Pawnkingthree (talk) 23:55, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose (unless of course the poor fellow dies). While it's certainly dramatic, this isn't going to be more than a brief footnote even in his own biography. And yes, the nomination is ludicrously partisan and filled with religious animus. We can and should do better, whatever our feelings on the subjects of our nominations and !votes. ETA: It seems his injuries are much more serious than I had thought. Still opposing posting it if he survives, but my thoughts are with him and his family. Tlhslobus, please consider retracting your needlessly inflammatory postscript to your nomination. GenevieveDEon (talk) 20:39, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Tentative Support - depending on how serious the wounding is; but after several hours of surgery, it looks bad. Not sure the logic that this assassination attempt would be a footnote, for a such a traumatic attack on a very prominent author; this goes well beyond book-burnings. Nfitz (talk) 21:19, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment Amended slightly given there is an article on this specific event Abcmaxx (talk) 21:39, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support per Nfitz XxLuckyCxX (talk) 21:42, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Weak support: would we post (hypothetically) an assassination attempt of Trump, Bin Laden (yes I know he is deceased), Jeff Bezos, Bill Gates, Cristiano Ronaldo, a current head of state, the current Pope, the previous Pope? I think we might do (God forbid) in all those cases. Rushdie is a worldwide figure and had a sizable part of the global population trying to kill him for a long time, that in itself is unprecedented. Abcmaxx (talk) 21:56, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Every single person you noted is more significant. GreatCaesarsGhost 22:34, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • This isnt even the most important story in NY today (like not a single NY paper/TV station outside of upstate NY itself is leading with this afaict). But Im a woke moslem (who somehow doesnt think Salman Rushdie should die so I guess Im pretty terrible at being both) so discount this plz. If he dies definitely merits a blurb even if he died naturally in his sleep, which one hopes he will do many many years from now. nableezy - 22:01, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It definitely is in the UK though, throughout all the media.Abcmaxx (talk) 22:03, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Id forgotten we were on Her Majesty's sovereign property at ITN, silly me. nableezy - 22:45, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose If he dies (G** forbid) I would switch to a support. -Ad Orientem (talk) 01:19, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I don't see what the issue here is with posting this. The event is clearly in mainstream news and significant in that a controversy running for well over thirty-years now has come to a head with extremists actually succeeding in finally attacking the author. Either the author's or the controversy's article can be linked, both of which appear to be fleshed out (unless the stub improves). Gotitbro (talk) 03:10, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. A perfectly healthy man just walked onto a stage and is now on a ventilator and unable to speak. His liver is damaged and he is set to lose at least one eye. That perfectly healthy man also happens to be a public figure with sustained international recognition/notoriety/controversy/whatever you want to call it, spanning, at this stage, many decades. Now, according to the above, it depends on "if he dies"? Where are the criteria that state a person has to be killed? Would the attempted assassination of Pope John Paul II be passed over if it happened today because he survived? (Probably not, because it's the Pope.) But why death? Talk:2011 Tucson shooting shows that the attempted assassination of a representative of Arizona's 8th congressional district was posted...
It's an unprecedented attack, on a scale usually reserved for politicians. It's not as if someone just walked up and kicked him... Three continents (and three countries with significant populations, where the English language is widely spoken) are linked to the individual concerned: India (population 1,407,563,842), U.S. (population 331,893,745) and UK (population 67,326,569). Even his knighthood has its own article. It wouldn't/couldn't set any precedent to post the average "local diarist/national bestseller has argument/gets beaten up" story. This is not the sort of event that happens every day. To get away from the US v UK dispute, it's headline news in Australia, Ireland, Saudi Arabia, France... and Iran, naturally.
To conclude, this tweet by Kylie Moore-Gilbert that I noticed on the website of a newspaper sums up the scale of the event: "More than 30 years and a $3million bounty later, Khomeini's poisonous fatwa has finally caught up with Salman Rushdie." (I am not familiar with her but I found it hard to disagree with that line). --Gaois (talk) 04:48, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Suggesting a more neutral wording that links to the history (if the attack article is not expanded). He didn't lose an eye or sustain damage to his liver from being "stabbed in the neck" as is stated above: "stabbed multiple times" is the current phrasing from the opening sentence of the attack article. --Gaois (talk) 05:15, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Anne Heche

[edit]
Article: Anne Heche (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian, Rolling Stone
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Just confirmed --Vacant0 (talk) 17:53, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • @Muboshgu: Am I reading the reports wrong? Her friends and family have confirmed death, the Guardian (very careful with their sources as a newspaper) followed up with California law (not British), and said life support was removed. Is it perhaps people who have done their own OR at the talk page and are asserting that they don't think brain death should be considered dead who have made you reconsider this? Kingsif (talk) 19:02, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Honestly, I'm confused. The Guardian says On Friday afternoon TMZ had reported Heche was “brain dead”, which under California law is the definition of death. It was announced earlier in the day Heche would be taken off of life support. I see no indication that she has been taken off of life support. – Muboshgu (talk) 19:14, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Yes, so, brain dead, body alive. Does that meet ITN RD requirements or do we wait for her to be taken off of life support? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ – Muboshgu (talk) 19:18, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    I mean, the family seem to be saying dead, California would agree, but it can't hurt to wait. I'd contribute at the talk page if it wasn't ridiculous at this point, kudos to EvergreenFir for trying to control all those, er, discussions. FWIW, I also imagine the time difference may be confusing the Guardian writer based on that "earlier in the day" part. Guess you have time to source her awards anyway. Kingsif (talk) 19:24, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Edit - think I found one though I'm outside US so can only access the cached version. Perhaps you can check it? It seems her name is listed as a nominee.
Direct link - http://www.tcm.com/tcmdb/title/458705/the-5th-annual-blockbuster-entertainment-awards/
Cached link - http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:6GGDrlNi8tsJ:www.tcm.com/tcmdb/title/458705/the-5th-annual-blockbuster-entertainment-awards/&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ie SitcomyFan (talk) 19:13, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Well, that website can be seen at https://web.archive.org/web/20220126120234/http://www.tcm.com/tcmdb/title/458705/the-5th-annual-blockbuster-entertainment-awards/#credits . She appeared as a "performer" , not nominee (credits section). I don't know if it is a valid source. Alexcalamaro (talk) 20:40, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I think all the nominees are listed as performers. SitcomyFan (talk) 23:30, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Surprised it wasn't up there. Royal Autumn Crest (talk) 22:48, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • The article is good enough. There's a few awards that are uncited. I can't find sources for them. But, ITN postings don't have to be "perfect". This isn't a GA review. WP:ITN says in part Articles should be well referenced; one or two "citation needed" tags may not hold up an article, but any contentious statements must have a source, and having entire sections without any sources is unacceptable. I don't think anyone is going to say a "Blockbuster Award" is contentious. – Muboshgu (talk) 23:46, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Posted. BTW, I have removed two mentions of "posthumous release" from the Filmography tables, as the sources are dated before her death. Please restore that when newer RS is available. Thanks. --PFHLai (talk) 00:29, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 11

[edit]
August 11, 2022 (2022-08-11) (Thursday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

International relations

Law and crime

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Jean-Jacques Sempé

[edit]
Article: Jean-Jacques Sempé (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Reuters
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Perhaps the most prominent French drawing artist (Le Petit Nicolas, covers of The New Yorker), recognizable without seeing the signature. Article was decent, but surprisingly short for such a giant. The works are all in his French National Library entry, which could easily be added as a ref if needed. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:39, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

 Posted. El_C 20:22, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Paul Green

[edit]
Article: Paul Green (rugby league) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): france24 and many others
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Rugby League player and coach from Queensland, Australia. Died unexpectedly at the age of 49. HiLo48 (talk) 04:31, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Bill Russell's number retired

[edit]
Snow closing this. No way consensus can develop. (non-admin closure) --RockstoneSend me a message! 09:57, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: Bill Russell (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Bill Russell's number is retired across all of the teams of the NBA. (Post)
News source(s): https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/34384678/bill-russell-no-6-retired-nba-following-legend-death-last-month
Credits:
Nominator's comments: This is the first time that happened in the NBA ever, and Bill Russell is a 11 time NBA champion. Sportsfangnome (talk) 05:39, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 10

[edit]
August 10, 2022 (2022-08-10) (Wednesday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

  • A house explodes in Evansville, Indiana, United States, killing at least three people, injuring one and damaging at least 39 nearby houses. (CNN)

Law and crime

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Corky Palmer

[edit]
Article: Corky Palmer (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Hattiesburg American; University of Southern Mississippi; WJTV
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Bloom6132 (talk) 09:24, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Lydia de Vega

[edit]
Article: Lydia de Vega (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): (Rappler)
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: She was "considered Asia's fastest woman in the 1980s." I already missing citations in this article. KTerPalmers (talk) 04:41, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

James Marape elected Papuan PM

[edit]
Proposed image
Article: 2022 Papua New Guinean general election (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ James Marape (pictured) is reelected unopposed as Prime Minister by the parliament of Papua New Guinea after his party Pangu Pati won the general election that took place in July. (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Nominator's comments: Government now formed and head of state (prime minister) chosen. Abcmaxx (talk) 22:44, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Has this been posted? Or has it been swamped, moved to the bottom / out of visibility, by all the other events that have since happened? QueensanditsCrazy (talk) 14:07, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment – Pretty stale at this pt. – Sca (talk) 13:29, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment/Oppose on quality more prose is needed on the government situation after the elections. We see that Marape's party won 38 of a possible 118 seats, which is well short of a majority, so I assume maybe he's in coalition with some other parties? Also, since it's a re-election and not a new PM, the key event is the election result rather than his election unopposed by parolaimrnt.  — Amakuru (talk) 13:47, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Raymond Briggs

[edit]
Article: Raymond Briggs (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Times
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Not in bad condition, but there are a few unsupported statements in there that need citations. Although I'd love to see a blurb on him, I don't think he merits it, objectively speaking. 2A00:23C7:2B86:9801:11F2:723B:CAC4:ABD9 (talk) 08:24, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I've been through adding refs this morning and I think it's OK (although another set of eyes doing a quick check to see I've not missed anything. I won't mark it as 'ready', but I think it probably is. 2A00:23C7:2B86:9801:11F2:723B:CAC4:ABD9 (talk) 09:12, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 9

[edit]
August 9, 2022 (2022-08-09) (Tuesday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

Health and environment

International relations

Law and crime

Politics and elections

Science and technology

Sports

(Posted) RD: Miles Warren

[edit]
Article: Miles Warren (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Te Kāhui Whaihanga New Zealand Institute of Architects
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Article has a couple of sections that need references but I see that a fellow architect has already started updating the article so it shouldn't be too far off. Schwede66 03:45, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Article should be good to go now. Schwede66 05:09, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Rudi Koertzen

[edit]
Article: Rudi Koertzen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ESPN Cricinfo
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Tragic news coming in from South Africa. Article requires some work on sourcing. I will get to it if no one gets to it before me. RIP. Ktin (talk) 20:56, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Mario Fiorentini

[edit]
Article: Mario Fiorentini (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Washington Post
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: The last and most decorated Italian resistance fighter in WWII. May need some cleanup. I translated the article from it.wiki. BeanieFan11 (talk) 20:14, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@BeanieFan11: I've added some cn tags, I think it will be easy to fix them. Otherwise the article looks good. _-_Alsor (talk) 16:09, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Alsoriano97: I think I've addressed all of the cn tags. BeanieFan11 (talk) 16:43, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
yes, you have. Thanks! _-_Alsor (talk) 16:46, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) 44th Chess Olympiad

[edit]
Article: 44th Chess Olympiad (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ The 44th Chess Olympiad concludes with Uzbekistan winning the open event and Ukraine winning the women's event. (Post)
News source(s): ChessBase, Deutsche Welle
Credits:

Article updated
The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Nominator's comments: What a result! Davey2116 (talk) 14:44, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

At least one of those photos by Yoshlar is a clear copyright violation of someone else's photo. It wouldn't surprise me if they all were. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 04:06, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
which one is a clear copyright violation? i believe the account is run by someone representing the uzbekistani youth affairs agency, and they are uploading their own pictures for use by wikipedia under a compatible creative commons license. the account's first upload is of a pdf which appears to address this. the agency's site also features some of the pictures uploaded. dying (talk) 05:04, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Ah, I thought this one was taken from here, but it is actually a little different. So maybe not. The others labelled with the agency name I don't recognize from anywhere else, those seem safer to use. Sportsfan77777 (talk) 05:22, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
actually, i tried digging a little deeper after you had raised the issue, and i think you're right about that picture. the uploaded one looks like a rotated version of the one credited to stev bonhage. i'm pretty sure the ones taken with the canon eos 5d mark iv are the agency's own, though i am admittedly not sure about the one taken with the iphone 12 pro max. dying (talk) 05:39, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Lamont Dozier

[edit]
Article: Lamont Dozier (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: The usual discography citation issues need to be fixed; no other issues I can see within the article's body. rawmustard (talk) 12:38, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Issey Miyake

[edit]
Article: Issey Miyake (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC News
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Died on 5 August but only announced today.  — Amakuru (talk) 10:47, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment article needs some work. I've added some cn tags, many of the sources are archived (which doesn't mean that the article is not of quality per se, but perhaps more current web pages can be found and used) and the "Issey Miyake lines and brands" section needs sources. _-_Alsor (talk) 18:57, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • There are currently a handful of {cn} tags that still need to be resolved before this nom can proceed. Please add more REFs. --PFHLai (talk) 17:54, 16 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Raid of Mar-a-Lago

[edit]
Consensus against at the moment, and furthermore, the article is AfD, which automatically disqualifies it from consideration. --Tone 11:57, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: Raid of Mar-a-Lago (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ In the United States, the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) raids Mar-a-Lago, one of the homes of former President Donald Trump (Post)
News source(s): https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/08/us/politics/trump-fbi-mar-a-lago.html
Credits:

Article updated
Nominator's comments: Unheard of in the United States. Therapyisgood (talk) 02:09, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I'm aware of how large of a story it is in the U.S.—I live here—but ITN is a global thing. Certain things from the U.S. do transcend ITN's usual disdain for U.S. centric news, such as the most recent blurb in ITN right now and the Uvalde shooting from months ago, but this is not one of them. It's part of a larger story for sure, but globally this has no impact on even someone from Canada. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 04:10, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
We have no requirements for "global impact" at WP:ITN and a specific note above about opposing because a story only relates to a single country. How is it these arguments are able to persist? --LaserLegs (talk) 09:26, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose This is part of a possible larger story related to Trump, but this one event is not the type of news to feature on the front page. --Masem (t) 03:39, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Wait a few days until we know if there’s an imminent indictment or not. If there’s not, I’ll support as a raid on a former president’s residence is completely unprecedented in US politics, and certainly notable enough to overcome “America-centrism.” The Kip (talk) 04:20, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I don't think we're going to post anything short of an indictment of Trump. – Muboshgu (talk) 04:43, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose A very unusual event, but currently no evidence it will lead to anything more significant. If it does lead to anything, that event can instead be nominated for ITN. Lewis Hulbert (talk) 05:04, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Lewis Hulbert Just noting that this sort of thing is not done even with non-politicians unless the FBI/Department of Justice already has substantial evidence of a crime and knows what they will find when the warrant is executed. Twitter is full of lawyers saying they would advise clients who this happens to that charges are likely coming. 331dot (talk) 09:30, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
WP:BLP applies, even to Trump. 331dot (talk) 10:55, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 8

[edit]
August 8, 2022 (2022-08-08) (Monday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

International relations

Law and crime

(Posted) RD: Luis Enrique Oberto

[edit]
Article: Luis Enrique Oberto (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): El Nacional
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Venezuelan MP and gvmt minister. Interestingly, he was the guy who first led the nationalization of Venezuela's oil industry. Curbon7 (talk) 07:46, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I had a look at those {cn} tags. It seems to me the problem was that the REF did not mention those years of elections. I have re-written and simplified that sentence to make it closer to what is in the REF. The same REF was also used later in the section for the 1998 election but the REF mentions nothing happening in 1998. I think another REF is needed. Announcements of retirement from politics were probably in the news, but I'm not sure how accessible info would be for something that happened in the previous millennium. --PFHLai (talk) 14:09, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Generalized the 1998 statement to just read as he left parliament in 1999. Curbon7 (talk) 21:22, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I think this is the best way to solve this. I too have found it impossible to find a source to support this content. _-_Alsor (talk) 21:29, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Daren Gilbert

[edit]
Article: Daren Gilbert (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): New Orleans Saints
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Death first reported on August 8. BeanieFan11 (talk) 22:05, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Herb Roedel

[edit]
Article: Herb Roedel (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): San Francisco Chronicle (via Legacy.com)
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Died on July 25, first reported today (August 8). BeanieFan11 (talk) 01:07, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Bill Graham

[edit]
Article: Bill Graham (Canadian politician) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CBC
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Canadian politician, served in government and was interim Leader of the Opposition. Article is in fairly good shape, but likely needs some additional citations, as some sections are missing cites. Kaiser matias (talk) 00:25, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Zofia Posmysz

[edit]
Article: Zofia Posmysz (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Independent, HuffPost
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Tractor Tyres (talk) 22:06, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Resistance fighter in World War II, Holocaust survivor, who wrote an audio play about her experiences in Auschwitz, which was turned into a play and an opera. The article, created by Edison and written mostly by Poeticbent and myself, seems in reasonable shape. I believe we should receive credit, but don't know where to put it. I would have nominated tomorrow, after consulting more obits. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:19, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Olivia Newton-John

[edit]
Article: Olivia Newton-John (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): AP, BBC
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Singer-songwriter & actress who has passed away due to breast cancer, perhaps best known for starring in the film adaptation of Grease. Please note there is no blurb for this nomination. I accidentally put RD/Blurb instead of just RD. XxLuckyCxX (talk) 19:25, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The source is a verified FB, but it's not been picked up by any news outlets (yet). EvergreenFir (talk) 19:32, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's starting to get around. – Muboshgu (talk) 19:34, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Parade is (so far) the highest quality source to report it. EvergreenFir (talk) 19:42, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
BBC reporting just now, so that should start the chain reaction for want of a better word XxLuckyCxX (talk) 19:44, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
See also Cosmopolitan, CNN and The NY Post XxLuckyCxX (talk) 19:46, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I was F5-ing BBC, so yes, that's solid for me. Article has some clean up needed though. EvergreenFir (talk) 19:47, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose blurb regardless of the discussion on the talk page, she really had only a few roles that made her significant, and the article failures to capture why she should be considered the top of her field. Articke is in poor quality (filmography etc needs refs) --Masem (t) 20:03, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Didn't mean to put it as a blurb, that is only there as a comment XxLuckyCxX (talk) 20:13, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Blurb per Masem MyriadSims (talk) 20:11, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support Blurb She had a career of almost 60 years with many famous roles and awards, I think that is blurb worthy. -- Maykii (talk) 20:12, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Going by previous similar nominations, it isn't. Pawnkingthree (talk) 20:17, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support 61.69.136.118 (talk) 14:01, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD - Article is of a good standard and certainly noteworthy. Mark E (talk) 15:58, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Same can be said about those opposing. But it's a bit vulgar to say so. Polyamorph (talk) 16:38, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
no, it's not vulgar. _-_Alsor (talk) 16:46, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Er, yes it is. Everyone here are volunteers. Polyamorph (talk) 16:54, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
So it's vulgar in the "common folk" sense. That doesn't make it "obscene" or "profane". Not precisely, anyway. InedibleHulk (talk) 17:07, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Vulgar as in distasteful, rude, obnoxious. Take your pick. Polyamorph (talk) 17:13, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe it's my oafish upbringing, but I see bluntly frank, brutally honest or (perhaps inconveniently) true. InedibleHulk (talk) 17:58, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Sure. Nothing wrong with thinking that. Just normally we don't blame others for not pulling their finger out here since we're all volunteers and especially when it is a case of pot, kettle, black. Polyamorph (talk) 18:45, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Stats Dame Olivia's article has had over 4 million readers so far this week and those are superstar numbers. For comparison, note that the 4 articles highlighted in our blurbs have only had a few thousand readers. Even the UEFA Women's Euro 2022 Final has only been averaging 1500 readers per day which is so low that it would look bad even at DYK. These numbers demonstrate that just about nobody is using the ITN blurbs to click through on our news selections. All this discussion therefore seems fruitless. And, looking at the actual top reads for yesterday, it's interesting to see hunger stone at #4. These provide a warning when the level is low: "Wenn du mich siehst, dann weine". A good analogy! Andrew🐉(talk) 09:08, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    We're not a newspaper, we care zero about viewer counts. We are looking for quality, not quantity, because we are posting a highlighted link on the main page, so it better represent the best we can do for an article. That past editors on ONJ's page have been sloppy about sourcing until now is not ITNs concern. Masem (t) 12:31, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    The point is that such gatekeeping is pointless because there is no fence. The huge flood of readers has already visited the article and moved on. Time is of the essence in such cases. Andrew🐉(talk) 22:34, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    If the purpose of ITN was "gatekeeping", I'd agree. However, the purpose of ITN is showcasing high-quality content, be it through OTD, ITN, DYK, or it being featured. If it's not high quality, it won't be linked from the main page. People can still find it if they wish. The system works. – Muboshgu (talk) 22:40, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    In fact, Andrew's numbers prove that readers found it. It's why ITN tries to avoid simple "popularity" as readers rarely have problems getting to those articles. We want to feature a better worldwide and topic-wide split of news that also represent quality WP work. Masem (t) 01:38, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    There is a boost is viewership from being posted as an RD, which is not to mean that readers won't go to the page if it is not posted. For example, Mo Ostin died on July 31 and was not posted until Aug 6, but still saw an increase of ~5000 views/day after the delay.—Bagumba (talk) 11:11, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support RD Just get it done already for God's sake! If she's not up by Monday then we shouldn't even post it at that point. MyriadSims (talk) 11:48, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment What you need to do is stop complaining because it's not published yet and start improving her article. Wikipedia is not a news portal, it's an encyclopedia, and the quality of the articles is fundamental. You can debate the rule that requires the quality of these to be included in MP, but this is certainly not the place. No matter how much you add other "Support RD", it will not be included as long as it remains orange-tagged and missing cn tags to be fixed. _-_Alsor (talk) 12:53, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    If you compare it to the standard of some other articles that get do posted it is actually in very good shape. ITN is not GA of FA review! The orange and cn tags were added (by you) since the nom. Polyamorph (talk) 15:52, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    yeah, but there are still more than 20 tags that need to be fixed. We're not going to make an exception for Olivia Newton-John and overlook them. And yes, I've added them...because there is unsourced content. What needs to be done. There's no debate. _-_Alsor (talk) 16:30, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment @Alsoriano97: I am making an attempt to go through and source the outstanding cn tags; hopefully it should be in better shape relatively soon. PCN02WPS (talk | contribs) 16:28, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    great! _-_Alsor (talk) 16:30, 11 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment If every voter had taken care of three or four citations, this would have run two days ago. Thriley (talk) 03:29, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support A few citations still needed for television roles and tours but otherwise article looks good and well-sourced. Once these minor subsections have been sourced (and I know how painstaking it can be - I'm relatively new to this but I've sourced a few RD articles now, one of which had a huge unsourced filmography, that almost got held up due to no citations in television roles but got there in the end) I think this should be listed. Not sure what the debate about the blurb is above as another comment says it wasn't nominated for a blurb, so I'm mainly supporting RD here but I'd also support blurb if it came to that as I think she was hugely famous and relevant even just based on her ″Grease″ role and her enduring popularity in the decades since. SitcomyFan (talk) 08:34, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your assistance.Polyamorph (talk) 09:06, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
One subsection is now fully sourced. Only one more subsection to source - the Tours section if other editors can give a hand, then the article will be completely sourced. SitcomyFan (talk) 13:37, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I did look for sources for the concert tours, they are surprisingly difficult to find. Polyamorph (talk) 13:53, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
A good resource might be www.onlyolivia.com - came in handy for a couple of the television roles in addition to other citations. If possible, though, try to add other sources as well in case it's considered not strong enough. It might be a good jumping off point, though, as well. SitcomyFan (talk) 14:10, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. I've added some. I can see you have too. The Only Olivia source is not great but it is better than nothing and certainly good enough to post in RD to prove the tours existed. It is frustrating that some of the stuff that is getting posted on ITN that are barely more than a stub and this now 267 reference article is being kept off the main page. Polyamorph (talk) 14:38, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Please note that stubby ones will be rejected, too. Just like poorly sourced ones. Longer articles have more contents that require citations. That's life in Wikipedia. --PFHLai (talk) 14:47, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I know they do get rejected, but not all. And I see some user responses to unsourced information is to just remove it to get it posted. That's also life in wikipedia. Polyamorph (talk) 14:49, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@PFHLai: take Leandro Lo for example. Many of his achievements are not sourced. Yet ONJ can't be posted because a few albums, appearances on TV, tours don't have sources (despite the fact these are basic facts). I am not complaining about the other articles being posted. Just the inconsistency in stringency of the application of the rules.Polyamorph (talk) 18:37, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The achievements in Lo's article are sourced by a preceeding source that covers the full list. If such a source existed for ONJ's albums, we can use that approach too. Masem (t) 18:50, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The albums are sourced. I added them. Not all tours are yet. But back to Lo's article, I'm talking about in the text and in the medals lists where there are achievements and stats that are unsourced. Polyamorph (talk) 18:59, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
On the line "Main Achievements (Black Belt)" there is a source [1], which is the source that we assume covers the full list given its location preceeding the list. Same with the second list in that section. I would think from looking at the source that that also covers the infobox information, and arguably the source shoudl be reused there too. Masem (t) 19:04, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The source for the infobox information is not clear. There is in text content that is not sourced. The issue here is if you're going to apply GA and FA criteria just to get onto RD then you need to be consistent.Polyamorph (talk) 19:11, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
If you don't feel like understanding it, don't understand it. It's your right to do so. But it doesn't change how ITN works. There are no more issues to debate. If you consider that Leandro Lo's article did not meet the quality requirements we demand from ONJ, you can orange-tag the article, include tags and ask people to improve it. _-_Alsor (talk) 19:19, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Where have I said I don't understand it? Of course I understand the importance of sourcing and verification. But it is not being applied consistently here at ITN. Polyamorph (talk) 19:25, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It is. In every nomination for RD or ITN. Everytime. _-_Alsor (talk) 19:30, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
That would suggest we're infallible. Which we most definitely are not. Polyamorph (talk) 19:43, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Sometimes it's a matter of whether mistakes and omissions are caught at the right time. To ignore {CN} tags already there? Let's not. -- PFHLai (talk) 19:54, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Is setlist.fm considered a RS? If so, many of these tours are listed on there. SitcomyFan (talk) 23:06, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's not listed at WP:Reliable sources/Perennial sources. As it is a wiki, I guess not. But might be enough to prove the tours existed? Polyamorph (talk) 03:57, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
There’s over a dozen Citation Needed tags in the article. You can help get it on RD if you assist in finding sourcing. Thriley (talk) 02:37, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I noticed you removed one - good call - and maybe at this stage, more of these claims need to be removed if they're holding up posting this article. Obviously, we should keep checking for citations (I've just added one and removed a tag) but if they're all holding it up, more might need to be removed. A lot of them seem oddly superfluous yet weirdly specific. And most of them seem like Original Research. SitcomyFan (talk) 16:00, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Two more statements removed, as from reading them seemed like original research and was unable to find any sources to back up. Could someone do the same with the rest? Mark E (talk) 22:09, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment once again we have horror and indignation at the fact this encyclopedia will not post an article full of unsourced claims. We also have the regular WP:TOP25 comparisons, that somehow we should be comparing ITN articles to the hits garnered by Love Island (or any of its derivatives), Kim Kardashian or anal sex. At some point we'll need to just foreclose those conversations at they are not relevant to individual candidates here: if people believe we should be posting "popular" news items, regardless of their quality, that's a debate to be held at WT:ITNC. That this conversation has not been held already is immediately damaging to the individuals in question who appear to be aiming to convert ITNC to "what has Donald Trump said and what is on the front page of The Sun". The Rambling Man (Keep wearing the mask...) 22:15, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's not full of unsourced claims. There are over 300 references. Any remaining issues are extremely minor and users are doing their best to fix them. Wikipedia is not perfect but no one can say this article is "full of unsourced claims". It simply isn't. You can post a dead walrus that no one had even heard of last week but not this? Polyamorph (talk) 07:44, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's a BLP so it needs to be watertight. Comparing it the walrus is futile, this isn't about notability. Very famous people are still people and their articles need to comply with BLP, regardless. You're better off fixing the remaining issues than complaining about why this won't be posted. The Rambling Man (Keep wearing the mask...) 08:10, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I have been helping to fix the issues! Several other users have also put in ALOT of effort sourcing the article! It is my opinion that it is good enough quality. RD do not have to be perfect, it is not GA or FA. Name the contentious content that is yet to be cited? Polyamorph (talk) 08:16, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It's remarkable that RD now reads "...
..." None of these are getting treatment of adequate quality IMO but so it goes. The fuss here is largely irrelevant because our readership decides for itself what it will read. Andrew🐉(talk) 17:35, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Many thanks SitcomyFan for all your efforts! Special thanks also to Thriley and PFHLai who helped source the article. Polyamorph (talk) 09:23, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! I’m still upset that Meat Loaf didn’t make it to RD due to a similar situation with numerous CN tags. So glad ONJ made it through. Thriley (talk) 15:06, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, @Polyamorph, but you have done a lot more for this wikibio. --PFHLai (talk) 21:46, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you Stephen. Polyamorph (talk) 12:55, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • post-posting support and comment I’ve added a cn tag in the fifth paragraph of the subsection "Early success". But this does not prevent the article from finally being included in RD. Great job on fixing the quality of it. _-_Alsor (talk) 14:53, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Roger E. Mosley

[edit]
Article: Roger E. Mosley (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC News, WaPo, NYT
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Magnum P.I. actor, who passed away in a tragic car crash aged 83. Article source to news of his death. Abcmaxx (talk) 14:08, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Leandro Lo

[edit]
Article: Leandro Lo (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC News
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Assasinated Shot this morning, sucessful world Ju-Jitsu champion. Article source to news of his death. Given he was an all-time great in the sport needs much longer article at least regarding his career. Abcmaxx (talk) 10:18, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment I don't think "Assassinated" is quite the right verb here. Our own article says that's for "a head of state, head of government, politician, member of a royal family, or CEO", and I would even have my doubts about the final one in that list. HiLo48 (talk) 21:50, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Intentionally shot which would amount to murder although probably need to wait for the conclusion of the trial to assert. Abcmaxx (talk) 07:52, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 7

[edit]
August 7, 2022 (2022-08-07) (Sunday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: David McCullough

[edit]
Article: David McCullough (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NYT (paywalled), PBS, AP, NPR, Reuters
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American historian. Sunshineisles2 (talk) 16:25, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I added a citation for the audiobook statement; Let me know if you think that that citation will work as it is or if we should break it up into several citations. KConWiki (talk) 00:44, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Eike Christian Hirsch

[edit]
Article: Eike Christian Hirsch (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Hannoversche Allgemeine
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: German journalist and author Grimes2 (talk) 13:14, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

August 6

[edit]
August 6, 2022 (2022-08-06) (Saturday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Disasters and accidents

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Tom Alberg

[edit]
Article: Tom Alberg (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): WSJ
Credits:

Article needs updating
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Article needs good amount of work. Short fuse. Will give it a try later this evening unless someone wants to get to it before me. Edits done. Article has shaped into a C-class biography. Meets expectations for homepage / RD. Given the short-fuse, greatly appreciate a pair of eyes on this one. RIP. Life well-lived. Ktin (talk) 17:00, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Boudjemaa Talai

[edit]
Article: Boudjemaa Talai (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): La Patrie News
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Algerian MP and government minister. Curbon7 (talk) 08:05, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) RD/Blurb: Archie Battersbee case

[edit]
No consensus for a blurb. RD was suggested but the requirement is that there should be a biographical article, which this is not. Check elligibility for DYK. --Tone 20:01, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: Archie Battersbee case (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  12-year-old Archie Battersbee dies when his life support is withdrawn following a protracted legal case in England (Post)
News source(s): https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-62346354
Credits:

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Significant legal case; UN involvement; significant press coverage in UK & overseas Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 13:58, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support Stub, but notable. Grimes2 (talk) 14:02, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose blurb as unimportant. Oppose blurb or RD on quality grounds. In terms of a blurb, this is a human interest story hyped by British media, but objectively unimportant; lethal accidents of children and legal disputes about keeping comatose patients alive are relatively frequent. Even as a RD entry, the article is a mess and not ready for the main page. There is very little prose, all in the lead. The rest is WP:PROSELINE bullet points and a table of court decisions without context. Sandstein 14:42, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose in general, this doesn't appear to be a case with long-term repurcussions. But I will stress the Oppose on quality - an article that is basically a timeline rather than a discussion of the issues around this isn't going to be sufficient for main page (and the fact that hasn't been done here suggests that this doesnt have the impact suggested). --Masem (t) 14:41, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment To begin with, if it’s a stub it cannot be supported: the quality of the article is something fundamental for it to be included on the Main Page. And this one is far from being in good condition. The RS, moreover, do not consider it as a landmark decision, so it may seem that the impact and the notability of the case is rather mediatic than legal, juridical and medical. And it should be noted that the UN intervention is at the request of the family, not by the decision of the organization itself. I have my doubts that it is ITNR-worthy. _-_Alsor (talk) 14:44, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
An improved version is maybe candidate for RD. Grimes2 (talk) 14:48, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, sure. _-_Alsor (talk) 14:50, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
...That's one hell of a misunderstanding of what happened. It's not sentencing someone to death if they're already dead... --RockstoneSend me a message! 00:21, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
LaserLegs, you're an American, right? This sounds alot like the Terri Schiavo case. Remember that? In neither case did the courts sentence anyone to death. – Muboshgu (talk) 00:43, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Schiavo's husband and legal guardian asked for the feeding tube to be removed in accordance with her wishes. In these cases, the children's primary caregivers - their parents - are being overruled by the courts and the children condemned to death. It's really quite abhorrent, really. Anyway I don't care if we post this or not, I just vaguely recalled a previous time UK courts ordered a child to die and shared the link to how it was handled that time. --LaserLegs (talk) 01:04, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
??? How is it being condemned to death? The children were not alive, their brains had stopped functioning. Crazy take. -- RockstoneSend me a message! 01:07, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Maybe read up on the case before commenting such absurd nonsense. The boy died in May from a catastrophic brain injury. The blood supply to his brain was cut off. His brain and other organs were necrotising.Polyamorph (talk) 06:44, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Laserlegs won't bother with the detail, he'll just see it as a chance to make specious claims against Brits. In the time it's taken me to write this sentence, there's a good chance another kid in Amurica has been shot to death. Pointless posturing. The Rambling Man (Keep wearing the mask...) 19:26, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I see. Thanks Polyamorph (talk) 19:40, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • It's overdone in the UK and far from news, nobody wants to hear about it in the slightest. Not a bio so no RD, I am honestly surprised there is an article that merits keeping since there hasn't even been a novel legal approach (let alone a precedent set). Just some parents struggling to accept their kid's death not shutting up about it, coinciding with silly season. Kingsif (talk) 14:36, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

(Closed) Escalation in the Gaza strip

[edit]
Truce announced and article orange-tagged. The Rambling Man (Keep wearing the mask...) 19:03, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article: Operation Breaking Dawn (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Israel launches Operation Breaking Dawn against the PIJ in the Gaza strip. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ Israel kills a senior PIJ leader, launching Operation Breaking Dawn against PIJ forces in Gaza
Alternative blurb II: ​ Airstrikes on the Gaza strip kill 44 amidst an Israeli military operation against PIJ forces.
News source(s): BBC, CNN, Al-Monitor
Credits:
And if the death toll is lower tomorrow? These things have been going in cycles for 70 years. HiLo48 (talk) 01:35, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Huh? I was referring to how the total death toll of the this military operation has reached a point where I think it's blurbworthy. Unless people already pronounced dead suddenly take breaths again, the death toll cannot go down. That the Israel-Palestine conflict has been ongoing for so long does not mean that the occasional escalations with very high death tolls are insignificant.  Vanilla  Wizard 💙 02:19, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
HiLo48, if the death toll somehow goes lower tomorrow we are talking zombies and that warrants a blurb imo AdrianHObradors (talk) 10:21, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
No. We're simply talking about a failure to communicate. Maybe it's a difference between Australian English and whatever your version is. HiLo48 (talk) 11:50, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Official death tolls cannot decrease, as far as I know. It is physically impossible. Not sure what it is about Australian English that might render it otherwise. 🌈WaltCip-(talk) 16:34, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 5

[edit]
August 5, 2022 (2022-08-05) (Friday)

Armed conflicts and attacks

Business and economy

Disasters and accidents

Law and crime

  • A Texas jury reaches a verdict against Alex Jones and orders that he pay $45.2 million in punitive damages to the parents of a 6-year-old boy killed in the 2012 Sandy Hook massacre for falsely claiming the shooting was a hoax. (Reuters)

Politics and elections

(Posted) RD: Dean Carlson

[edit]
Article: Dean Carlson (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Fillmore County Journal
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 BeanieFan11 (talk) 15:57, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Peter Schowtka

[edit]
Article: Peter Schowtka (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Sächsische Zeitung
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Curbon7 (talk) 23:21, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Narender Thapa

[edit]
Article: Narender Thapa (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Hindu
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Indian footballer. Article has shaped into a start-class biography. Just meets the minimums for homepage / RD. RIP. Ktin (talk) 05:09, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Ali Haydar

[edit]
Article: Ali Haydar (Syrian army officer) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): (Syrian Observatory For Human Rights)
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Syrian deposed military officer. Article seems good. _-_Alsor (talk) 11:41, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Cherie Gil

[edit]
Article: Cherie Gil (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Manila Times CNN Philippines
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Filipino actress. Jollibinay (talk) 11:10, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Good. May Ms Gil rest in peace. We'll let this nom rest in peace, too. --PFHLai (talk) 22:17, 12 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RD: Judith Durham

[edit]
Article: Judith Durham (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): ABC, BBC, Guardian
Credits:

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Australian singer, songwriter and musician who was lead singer of the Australian popular folk music group The Seekers HiLo48 (talk) 08:13, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

A false objection. Almost every "disc" is a Wikilink. Sourcing needs to be in those articles, not necessarily in this article. HiLo48 (talk) 22:34, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Chinese military exercies around Taiwan

[edit]
Consensus to post is unlikely to develop per WP:SNOW. HurricaneEdgar (talk) 08:13, 6 August 2022 (UTC) (non-admin closure)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Template:ITN candidate

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

August 4

[edit]

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2022 August 4 Template:Cob

(Posted) RD: Neil Castles

[edit]

Template:ITN candidate

  • Long enough with 500+ words of prose, footnotes at expected spots, formatting looks fine, and Earwig reports not troubles, this wikibio is READY for RD. --PFHLai (talk) 06:54, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support. Articles is of sufficient quality for ITN/RD. BeanieFan11 (talk) 15:14, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support good to go. _-_Alsor (talk) 18:51, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose There are some things missing. Firstly, for a person involved in motor car or bike racing, they would drive for a certain type of team, and drive a certain type of car, which is not explained at all. There is no mention of any of this. Further, there is no mention of any career ups or downs. He raced for two decades, and there is just a comment on the number of placings. For example, he came 4th and 5th overall in the whole league in a couple of years. There are also issues that are skimmed through example in various online obits, but raise issues that need to be dug into further in historical news sources or books - The WP article gives an anecdote that he used firearms against race officias, and another link says this was a recurring pattern. This would need to be explained, as any reader would expect that there will be sanctions (maybe even criminal) for shooting at/threatening other participants/officials. There also seem to be sanctions for physical altercations with other people, and allegations of racism that are not addressed. Bumbubookworm (talk) 19:58, 9 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • How is the employer/team of a sportsperson not a relevant fact? How is it trivial to know what the consequences of assaulting a sports official/umpire is, especially with a gun (when the subject himself is bragging that he fired at a race official)? I'm sure many people who monitor this area would know that you try to flood the place with articles (regardless of quality) for WikiCup points Bumbubookworm (talk) 03:36, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Err, right, the issue of WikiCup distorting behaviour has come up plenty of times in the past across a wide range of fora, not about any specific editor, and I am not participating in any metric-based competitions. And you haven't explained why it is ok for a sportspersons bio to have no information whatsoever on what team they represent, career progressions, team changes etc Bumbubookworm (talk) 04:03, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
You do realize I nominate ITN articles outside of the WikiCup competition, don't you? Are you going to also argue that I'm "flood[ing] the place with articles" to gain offseason WikiCup points too? You're really looking silly now and reaching. —Bloom6132 (talk) 04:26, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
None of the sources covering his career stats (ESPN, Racing-reference.info) mention the teams he represented or changes (apart from racing under his own name). If you want to invent some names out of thin air, be my guest. —Bloom6132 (talk) 04:26, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Also, you do (or should) know of the issue of gun control in the US. The lack of laws in this area makes it more likely that he escaped any sanction than to be charged with any offence. —Bloom6132 (talk) 03:54, 10 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Closed) Brittney Griner

[edit]

Template:Archive top Template:ITN candidate

The signficance comes from the fact that she is a US citizen (and a black lesbian) prominently detained in Russia just before its invasion of Ukraine. The potential for her to be used as a political bargaining chip, or treated badly because of her identity as distinct from her alleged offence, is relevant. I don't think the story currently merits ITN, but it would be naive to ignore the context. GenevieveDEon (talk) 18:00, 4 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose A high profile case sure, but not a particularly noteworthy sentence. Drug smuggling gets punished far worse in countries like Malaysia or Indonesia. 🌈  4🧚‍♂am KING 👑  16:00, 4 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Other countries' severe punishments are not relevant to this case. GenevieveDEon (talk) 18:00, 4 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
all im saying is for the crime committed, the punishment isn't particularly severe. 🌈  4🧚‍♂am KING 👑  19:03, 4 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Abot

August 3

[edit]

Template:Cot Portal:Current events/2022 August 3 Template:Cob

(Posted) RD: Barry Downs (architect)

[edit]

Template:ITN candidate

RD/blurb: Olga Kachura

[edit]

Template:ITN candidate

(Posted) RD: Jack Deloplaine

[edit]

Template:ITN candidate

RD: Johnny Famechon

[edit]

Template:ITN candidate

Wait as per @HiLo48 says, article needs work. MyriadSims (talk) 18:29, 5 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Jackie Walorski

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August 2

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(Posted) RD: Melissa Bank

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(Posted) RD: Alastair Little

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(Posted) RD: Vin Scully

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(Posted) RD: David Bawden

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(Closed) US congressional delegation to Taiwan

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  • Oppose while the visit is stressing US / China / Taiwan relations, it is currently only posturing. There may be potential for a larger story (China has forces on the border for some military action) but until that happens, this is just a diplomatic visit. Masem (t) 15:39, 2 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - Unless anything significant happens, the rest is just sabre rattling, at any rate this is premature and not different from any other diplomatic event affecting relations between two countries. 🌈  4🧚‍♂am KING 👑  16:17, 2 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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August 1

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(Posted) RD: T. Mohandas Pai

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(Posted) RD: Robert E. Simanek

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(Posted) RD: Lars Tate

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(Posted) RD: Tom Cornell

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Template:Yo, Template:Yo, Template:Yo? Thriley (talk) 23:34, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Anastasiya Kobzarenko

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Comment- Article does not show the cause of death. Alex-h (talk) 15:29, 2 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

because we don't know, but at age 88, perhaps no surprise. The sentence about her death is there now. Can't find a place of death. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:10, 4 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
adding: this woman did miracles for libraries of children, making the buildings pieces of art, see here. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:35, 5 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

(Posted) RD: Joseph A. Doorley Jr.

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(Posted as blurb) RD/Blurb: Ayman al-Zawahiri

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  • Support blurb There are several sections which have citation needed tags, but I expect this to be resolved very quickly. I'm unsure about a blurb though. MarioJump83 (talk) 22:18, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Supporting a blurb, this is a VERY significant news. MarioJump83 (talk) 01:00, 2 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support blurb pending page improvements. This is a story we should blurb! This isn't "old man dies", this is a military operation taking out a top terrorist. He's been wanted since 9/11. – Muboshgu (talk) 22:30, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support blurb Per above. He's the leader of al-Qaeda. This is quite significant. GWA88 (talk) 22:33, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support blurb As other editors have commented, al-Zawahiri leads al-Qaeda, the role in which he had succeeded Osama bin Laden, perhaps the world's most famous terrorist leader. Especially given that widespread expectations had been for him to be hiding in Pakistan, there is no longer a U.S. military presence in Afghanistan, and there is no clear successor to al-Zawahiri, creating the possibility of a split in the group. I mean, if England defeating Germany in the Euro is considered relevant enough for ITN, there is no reason this shouldn't be.Augusthorsesdroppings10 (talk) 22:42, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Strong Support: This is a major development and though we are not a news site, this one in particular warrants categorization as an event and not a mere death. BOTTO (T•C) 22:45, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support blurb—Not only was he the longtime leader of al-Qaeda following Osama's death, but he was actually the brains of the organization even back when he was his predecessor's right-hand man. He was one of the main masterminds behind numerous al-Qaeda operations, including the 9/11 attacks. He merits a full blurb. Kurtis (talk) 23:08, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Added proposed blurb -- RockstoneSend me a message! 23:23, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • Oppose Al Qaida hasn’t carried out a successful terrorist attack, or posed a threat to US national security, in years if not a decade-plus. ( Timeline of al-Qaeda attacks ) Joe Biden claimed he would cease US military operations in Afghanistan. 23:31, 1 August 2022 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:642:4C09:2403:9138:C38E:53FA:7544 (talk)
Support blurb The September 11 attacks perpetrated by Al Qaeda and planned by al-Zawahiri had a significant impact on US foreign policy and global geopolitics in the 21st century. This drone strike is a significant event. Geopony (talk) 23:55, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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I’m being completely objective & NPOV in saying that Al Qaida hasn’t carried out a successful terror attack in years, and hence this is not sufficiently notable for a blurb. Just look at the Al Qaida timeline I linked to.
In contrast, Joe Biden, with his 37% public approval rating, is desperate anything resembling a win to save his party in the midterms. That’s why he’s making this out to be a bigger deal than it actually is. 23:40, 1 August 2022 (UTC) 2601:642:4C09:2403:9138:C38E:53FA:7544 (talk) 23:40, 1 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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(Closed) 2022 European heat waves

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(Closed) July 2022 United States floods

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NWS Kentucky Flooding Map for the 2022 Eastern Kentucky floods between July 25, 2022 to July 29, 2022

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